this post was submitted on 11 May 2025
280 points (100.0% liked)
Games
18996 readers
541 users here now
Video game news oriented community. No NanoUFO is not a bot :)
Posts.
- News oriented content (general reviews, previews or retrospectives allowed).
- Broad discussion posts (preferably not only about a specific game).
- No humor/memes etc..
- No affiliate links
- No advertising.
- No clickbait, editorialized, sensational titles. State the game in question in the title. No all caps.
- No self promotion.
- No duplicate posts, newer post will be deleted unless there is more discussion in one of the posts.
- No politics.
Comments.
- No personal attacks.
- Obey instance rules.
- No low effort comments(one or two words, emoji etc..)
- Please use spoiler tags for spoilers.
My goal is just to have a community where people can go and see what new game news is out for the day and comment on it.
Other communities:
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
society should normalize having crypto-miners in software, like as an official method of monetization that the user consents to
that would actually fix most of our problems, no ads, no subscrption fees
I don't see a downside to this
edit: if you disagree with me on this, reply. I wanna debate this
There are several issues with that.
First and foremost. Most people's devices are not powerful enough to make any money mining any cryptocurrency.
Also a cryptominer is not "free real state" it chugs the computer. The user would have a terrible experience trying to do anything with a cryptominer on the background.
And finally, there are many free software out there. Not everything is to be monetized. Some things should just be free. I have done plenty of free things for others to enjoy, it's not the end of the world, quite the opposite is quite rewarding.
That depends on the currency. Miners working on something like bitcoin have to compete with massive corporations who construct special ASIC chips that have vastly higher hash rates, making it impossible for anyone who isn't using such a chip to create any profit. Some currencies, like Monero (XMR) use special hash functions designed is such a way that custom mining hardware for them cant be constructed, and so mining can only happen on cpus. Because of this, its actually possible to make money mining Monero. There's a benchmark for the hash rates of various cpus, and here's a link to convert that to projected profits. My PC can calculate 3500 hashes per second, and this translates into USD 0.0045 per hour. That might not seem like much, but if you add together all the money that would be produced by all the players in this game, it would become substantial.
That all depends on how many threads the miner is running. I honestly wouldn't be able tell if I'm running 2 threads of a Monero miner on my PC unless I look at my task manager - its really not that intensive at that level. Now of course, if it was using the full power of my cpu, I would be a lot hard to do any other task on it, but it doesn't need to run at full power like that.
I agree and this game costs something to run, all the server costs and the API costs, and there needs to be some way of paying for that. I suppose it could become free if it was sustained with donations, and in that case having the option to run a miner like this on the client could be a way to add to that, giving the user the option to donate their computing power if they wanted to.
0.0045 per hour at 100%.
As we don't want to use all power let's say 50% power. So about 0.0028usd per hour.
Geoguessr most basic plan is 2.50usd month. The miner would need to be running 893 hours that month. Which is about 29 hours a day, wich is impossible.
With the miner running like 10 hours per week the developers would get the amazing quantity of 0.112 usd per month.
That kind of thing is used in malware because if you stole is actually real state. But for legit usage it's hard to justify without a dedicated operation.
Btw are you checking if your monero mining is really profitable? Last time I checked xmr mining was no profitable with any type of hardware unless electricity cost were basically free. I have both a beefy computer and a power efficient computer, checked with both and neither were profitable to use for mining.
Counter-point:
crypto-mining should be illegal, period. (and so should AI)
We're on the brink of climate collapse, we as a species can't afford to waste massive amounts of electricity on something that literally creates no value.
its the fault of the miner if they're using non-environmental friendly energy sources. if you don't wanna create emissions, just use solar power.
I don't really see how. if it can be sold for something of value, it has value. crypto might be useless to you, but to some people out there a single Bitcoin is worth more than 80 thousand dollars, so if you have a few Bitcoin, even though to you they might be useless, you can sell them for money
If you have access to solar power, it would be better to use it for something else, or feed it back into the grid.
As long as we're still burning fossil fuels to create electricity anywhere on earth, wasting any kind of energy is bad.
Crypto has a price (because people believe that it has a price).
It doesn't add any value to anything. It's expensive (in terms of energy cost) and absolutely, 100% useless.
So your saying that if I use solar power to power a lightbulb that then I forget to turn off, that's bad?
Uh actually it is not useless, no idea where you got that, there's tons of things you can buy with it. Other than drugs (which alone provide a use case, but il continue anyway), you can pay for protonmail, buy computer and other stuff. and theres a few lists (https://monerica/ .com/ is one) with a bunch of more stuff you can do with it. (I'm not endorsing anything here, just saying it exists)
crypto just facilitates more trade over the internet, thats how its useful
My electricity bill would like to have a word
I bet most of the upvotes are from people who consider crypto mining to be "free money" because they don't pay their own electric bills.
Its only 'free money' if you have an extremely cheap electric bill of use solar, and even then its hard to produce more than a hundred a month. I'm not an idiot.
But would it cost more to pay for the extra electricity or for the product? At least for the electricity you could invest in solar and lower your bill dramatically
That sounds terrible. Also a lot of games use the gpu so you probably don't want to share it with mining at the same time
the randomX hash function Monero uses runs on the CPU, not the gpu
it could just use like 1-2 threads if the game is taking a lot of processing power
edit: if ur gonna mass downvote me, say why 🤦
You can already mine on your own and use that money to pay for stuff if it's viable. This is just displacing the subscription into your electricity bill.
ik, but it would just be more practical to combine the several steps of mining separately, converting the currency, and then paying for the subscription into a single process. Just the option of this would be nice ngl
This feels like a technical approach for a solution to a political problem. We shouldn't normalize a solution to a predatory approach that companies have, we should regulate so that the approach can't be taken by companies on the first place, we should foster competition so that those who do are going to be outcompeted etc.
Wasting even more electricity to compute numbers used in an unstable speculative market with no clear future is IMHO a completely wrong approach to the problem.
There still needs to be some way for the devs to pay the server costs and API costs. What I'm suggesting is a way for the user to sell their processing power to them instead of paying an irritating $2 every month. And while the price of cryptocurrencies vary, they don't vary fast enough to make mining profits (if you sell the coins as you produce them) unpredictable
I understood what you meant, not sure why you would assume otherwise. My point is that there is no need to invent new business models. Your proposal is similar to "pay with your data", a new business model that has negative consequences for the collectivity.
In case of these types of games, a flat rate for the game and potentially a pay-per-use without margin to cover hosting (minimal, can be factored in the initial price) and API calls (gMaps) could be an option. Or none of this, and they factor in the cost already in the initial purchase. Either way, to come back to the topic of discussion, asking a one year subscription for a game sold for free (to lure people in) is IMHO predatory behavior with no excuse.
Anyway, tl;dr money already exists and people can pay for that, we don't need to waste more computing power to find an alternative. The use of crypto incentives the overall crypto market which causes even more people (or companies) to waste energy for nothing.
Nobody wants a shitcoin miner taking resources on their machine
I don't think its a horrible idea but maybe have an option for purchase, ads, or crypto. But yeah people are going to hate you for this comment 🤣
that's what I'm thinking, but additionally having a option to directly 'sell' your computing power should also be an option
actually though. I haven't been on Lemmy for too long but this might be the most downvotes ive gotten on a comment
Congratulations. It happens. I didn't think it was too bad an idea. What if steam ran the miner to produce steam bux?
That would be a huge waste of ressources. We as humans need to switch to carbon-free energy sources and should not start wasting ressources on mining "steam bux".
Sure, but we're not going to suddenly move to some Star Trek commie utopia. For now, developers need to get paid. Either I goto work and make money (burning carbon) to pay for it, or advertising (toxic) pays for it, or crypto mining (also toxic). How does this developer, living under capitalism, buy food, housing and medical without something to make money? Goodwill donation links are unlikely to cut it.
You are correct - but we totally have ways of monetization that don't require you to burn a lot of energy. Like normal money for example.
crypto mining doesn't need to create carbon. if a miner creates emissions, that's on them for not using solar
Opportunity costs still exist
I totally disagree here. First of all, the initial proposal was for the steam client to mine crypto. The client has no idea where its electricity comes from. And no grid is using 100% renewables, so its currently better to feed your solar power into the grid than to waste it on crypto
If the client cared to find out, they could just find out. Regardless of mining they're creating emissions if its not green, so its not even that big of a problem. You could use this same argument to say that using microwaves is bad because the electricity they use isn't entirely green.
I meant "the steam client".
why would the software need to know where its electricity is coming from?
I would pay good dollar money to be this stupid.
Do you think solar panels come from thin air? How is that going to do anything but offset renewable adoption?
I don't really care about this outside of brainstorming but do you think the economic activity you engage in to earn a wage and purchase a game is entirely without consequence?
When you shed microplastics and emit carbon on your way to work does that just not factor into your equation?
When you do meaningless trivial work for a corporation that pollutes for profit is that not also wasteful?
Even if you as a person have some magical green job, most of us don't have that luxury. Most of our jobs are just as dirty and polluting as crypto mining.
Passing the “carbon credit” on to my employment is kinda outside of my hands, since that is dictated by my employer, which few are lucky enough to have a meaningful decision in. People also don’t work an extra amount that somehow corresponds to “waste money” but budget out the amount they earn.
As an idea, using crypto to offset the API costs to crypto and thus to electricity usage is wild because I’m still paying the same dollar amount, just in electricity that I have then wasted, and not directly on the game without all the middle man BS. So instead of paying for API + profit, I’m paying for electricity, which is then wasted generating crypto to pay for a game I could just pay for directly without the excess energy waste.
So you just categorize the pollution generated by your employment as an externality and ignore it.
More that it isn't relevant to this discussion because in the hypothetical you're still spending the same amount, just on electricity instead of the game cost.
And yes, because labor rights are a joke in this country. I've got bills to pay and mouths to feed.
Now you're just being rude.
Given the comment I'm responding to, I felt it was appropriate.
I've reread this several times and I still have no idea what you're trying to say.