this post was submitted on 26 May 2024
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No Stupid Questions

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I'm not sure if this is the right community for this question, but it says "no stupid question" so here goes. I'm an Israeli who now lives in the US, but I am considering permanently residing in the US or elsewhere (perhaps somewhere in Europe or Canada) because I've become kinda disillusioned with Israel for a variety of reasons (the war in Gaza being one of them, the erosion of democracy by Likud being another, and etc) but is that cowardly to leave? Should I go back and try to change society or should I just leave for good? Thanks for your time.

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago

Nobody can answer this question for you but I think to the countless examples of people not "getting out while they can" who are now--or were until their death--forever trapped in a bad situation that people today forget wasn't that bad even within living memory

Is it right for you? I don't know

Is it cowardly to let a sense of national loyalty compel you to be exposed to the mechanisms of government wielded by untrustworthy actors? No, and anybody saying otherwise is lying to you at best; lying to themselves at worst

Inb4 any what aboutisms: nothing I've said here is specific to any country

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago

You need to decide what you want from your life. It is not your responsibility to "fix" Israel. If you feel truly passionate about it then go for it.

But if you're worried about this out of a vague sense of guilt or responsibility then park it. You get one life to live - don't waste it doing something your don't want to do or are not passionate about. Live a good life and strive for happiness, and try to be kind and good to those you meet on the journey - that is all that can be asked of anyone.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago (2 children)

You need to do whats best for yourself, but it sounds like Israel would be a better place with your voice in it.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

How do you mean?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

It's not super relevant but Israel doesn't allow offshore voting, the only way to vote if you live abroad is to physically travel to Israel on voting day. (This doesn't apply to those on official government business, like ambassadors or navy soldiers or whatnot)

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago

It's your choice.

The whole "be the active person who stops the riches from ruining earth" trope is a lie.

The current US is just as bad as Israel if not worse.

All the losers who either flunked high school or flunked, but had daddy to pay their way have brought fascism back en masses.

If you have the luxury to move to Sweden, or the Bahammas, as far as I'm concerned, do it.

You'll be in a better place when Israel nukes Iran, WWIII pops off, and the US cripples the internet/critical infrastructure around the world.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago (3 children)

i personally think whoever still lives in israel or palestine and maybe even has kids there, after 80 years of conflict, is crazy. it's basically "the badlands" and i think you should cut ties and settle down in a safer environment.

i don't think the US or Canada is the perfect place to live, but it's definitely better and safer than israel. i think EU, New Zealand, Australia and Britain would be even better, but you already live in the US and moving to another nation is often a lot of work, so maybe it's best to stay there. The differences in quality of life are very small IMO.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago

Yeah I gave birth to a son here in the US, which I think is a better environment for him than Israel personally.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago

I've quit jobs due to ethical disagreements, I'm sure I'd leave my home country if things got too bad. It wouldn't be the country i grew up in anyways.

You do you, people will both agree and disagree with you no matter what you chose.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago (1 children)

That's entirely subjective and up to you, however, I feel like I should point out we're dealing with our own erosion of democracy issues in the United States as well.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago (2 children)

I assume Trump won't win again so its better here in the US than in Israel where the Israeli Trump keeps winning.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago

It's possible Trump will win again. And even if he doesn't, he's not the only threat. There's so the emboldened MAGAts, a resurgent white nationalist / neo-Nazi / christofascist movement being weaponized, an unapologetically corrupt Supreme Court, a Republican party that's too scared of their own voters to do their job, a heavily militarized and intolerant police force, and plans to forcibly re-make the country with the next Republican president.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago (4 children)

It's very possible Trump will win again.

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[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Well, if Israel loses the support of other countries, there might not be an Israel. Id also hide the fact youre a Jew, anti-semitism is on the rise, not just anti-zionism.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

Yeah I know anti semitism is on the rise, which does make me weary, but there's also lots of institutional support against racism and anti semitism

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I want to tell you to not listen to these comments, but all of them tell you to decide for yourself. Well, you asked the question, so I will answer.

Yes, and move to Palestine.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago
[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Avoid Canada, or at least Toronto/Vancouver. Country is not in a great state atm.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

Mainly housing. A lot of western countries have housing issues but Canada is one of the worst. Extremely unaffordable here.

Is it important to you to live in a Jewish community? Where I live in Canada there aren’t very many Jews but I think there is a bigger community in Toronto. Nothing like you’d find in New York or Los Angeles though.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

Oh I see. Yeah Ive heard Canada is horribly expensive.

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[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago (1 children)

If you could make change, you could probably make change in other countries as well.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago

Less so since I'm not a citizen of those countries.

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