this post was submitted on 25 Jul 2023
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Mildly Infuriating

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My father just died in his sleep. He had passed by the time the paramedics arrived.

They still did their best, which I am very grateful for, but they even an entire trash bag full of used instruments that were stuffed under the bed for some reason

I'm glad that I found it sooner over later but it's mildly infuriating that they just discarded their medical waste under his bed.

(NSFW some blood)

I've been taking care of him for over 5 years and it's made things a lot harder for me, seeing all of that all over.

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[–] [email protected] 86 points 2 years ago (1 children)

First off I’m terribly sorry for your loss. While I am by no means a paramedic I took first aid classes from one and this very subject came up (what to do with used PPE and such after an incident). We were told to just leave it pending hazmat-trained folks responding for cleanup. At a patient’s home it’s left and frankly not their responsibility - the patient alone is.

Sucks but they will indeed leave stuff behind - I wish it had been a better outcome for your family but I assure you they meant no offense or harm.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I understand and I know that they were focused elsewhere, but the trash bag was stuffed far under the bed with everything spilling out...

I reached for what I was and was, as I couldn't see, and my hand got covered in blood and other fluids.

They were here waiting on the medical examiner for over an hour, so they must have forgotten about it somehow.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Ugh that sucks. I can only guess that it was an oversight but you’re absolutely right to be bothered. As you suggest, likely a moment of “get this bag out of the way”. Still upsetting for sure.

While it was thankfully brief I also was part of end of life care for my Dad and despite the anguish I took great comfort from knowing his last hours were with loved ones nearby and in his own bed. I wish that the knowledge you were there and helped brings you solace in your grief. You were there when it mattered most. hug I wish you and your family peace.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Thank you very much. I really appreciate your kind words.

In this world, I only had my dad and grandmother. I took care of them both for years. My grandmother passed in February, and dad's mind just imploded. She was more "smother" over a mother, so he was in the process to learn how to adult despite having severe paranoid schizophrenia

He was doing so well too, I taught him how to buy clothing and how to use uber.

He was for sure happy when he passed as I kept him reassured that he was safe and "the government doesn't know where you are"

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 years ago

Be proud of yourself, you’re a good kid to have his back like you did.

[–] [email protected] 81 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

My condolences on your pop.

Regarding leaving behind biohazard... You'd be surprised that the vast majority of first responders aren't trained for it and are liable if they try. Yes, it's kinda crazy and varies heavily by state.

First responders of any kind aren't trained for the cordiality or technical aspects of cleaning up biohazard scenes. It's very common. They're trained for patient care and that's it. They leave messes behind. They won't wash blood off your sidewalk. It's like walking into a personal nightmare for most people. Trained EMTs and paramedics are supposed to keep their PPE bagged and taken out with them, but if things get hectic, which is why they're there in the first place, stuff gets overlooked. Someone below already mentioned that it would've gotten shoved away to make room and it just gets forgot since it's not visible anymore

The fact of the matter is that they're there to triage and get them to the hospital, not tidy up after attempting to save someone's life.

The situation is macabre but it's a common one. A lot of people have felt that same weird surprise going back to where there loved one was to just find it a mess. There's no laws about them needing to clean. It's not the first time it's been brought up though.

If you're in the right state of mind you can call the nonemergency county line and ask if they have cleanup services for first responder scenes... the vast majority don't though. Those that do usually take a day or more to get there.

9/10 times it's family doing all of it.

I work pretty closely with just about every type of first responder in my line of work just to qualify this a bit... I've had to deal with this same issue in my personal life and professional. It's the same just about everywhere from what I know.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/2013/05/02/cleaning-up-crime-and-accident-scenes-a-grim-task/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK499999/

https://www.ems1.com/legal/articles/detroit-mandates-first-responders-clean-bloody-scenes-CQ4raY15GiJjbQW9/

https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1123029

EDIT: I did forget to say that those cleanup services are usually going to cost YOU out of pocket. Some states or counties subsidize them though...

Also minor grammar/clarifications.

[–] [email protected] 50 points 2 years ago (1 children)

OP, sorry. Resuscitation can be chaotic and there is a chance that the bag got pushed off to the side and then they missed it cleaning up.

That does not make it okay because it looks like their BVM is in the bag, which means that was placed their after the resuscitation. Your picture doesn’t show anything aside from the little bit of blood that isn’t just garbage, so don’t worry about how to get rid of it, just throw it in the trash. But again, sorry, I’ve never personally and I haven’t worked with anyone who would intentionally leave garbage on a scene after an attempted resuscitation, it’s a small detail that someone’s family shouldn’t have to think about in this kind of situation.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 years ago (1 children)

That's good to know, thank you.

I had nightmares about this bag last night so I'll be glad when it's out of my life.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Happy to help. Seriously tho, just toss it all. Even that little bit of blood isn’t significant. But don’t let this bag bother you too much it’s nothing to do with your dad it’s just the packaging for the meds they used plus probably some saline. You said in another comment that they were waiting for the medical examiner, which if that’s true then it would be illegal for them to remove anything that they had in place for the attempted resuscitation.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

That's a really good point. Yeah, they are doing a full investigation because they have to in Washington state if a person passes away at home.

I'm not really a fan of talking to the police, but they didn't really even talk to me. It's such an obvious thing that he died in his sleep, I suppose.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 years ago

I also don’t like talking to the police, even more so when I’m off duty, but I work in Florida and I’ve worked in a few counties, some after I attempted resuscitation I’d call the medical examiner’s office and tell them what’s going on and then they’d say if they wanted to come investigate or not, but currently where I work operates the same as you’re describing medical examiner comes out and investigates any death that didn’t happen under direct care of a physician.

Anyway, I’m sure you’ve got a lot going on so please toss that bag of garbage, it isn’t worth your time and effort to think about and I wish you the best in this tough time.

[–] [email protected] 44 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I’m sorry about your dad.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 2 years ago

Thank you, I really appreciate it.

[–] Remy685 18 points 2 years ago (2 children)

It's likely that it was kicked under the bed by accident. Cardiac arrests are one of the most stressful calls a paramedic can run. The fact that it was bagged up at all means that were trying to keep the scene neat as they worked.

But once they terminated resuscitation efforts the call switches to documentation, paperwork, medical examiner notifications, dealing with an upset family who may have trouble processing or accepting the death. They probably just lost track of it at that point.

If you don't feel comfortable touching it, there are cleanup services that will remove it. My agency doesn't have a special way of disposing it, it just goes in the regular trash (except for sharps or course, but I don't see any in your picture, and I hope they wouldn't leave those around).

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 years ago

I'm a paramedic and echo these sentiments (especially about the sharps).

Sorry for your loss OP

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

That's excellent to know. I was about to ask about the best way to dispose of it. I can handle it now that the shock of it all has gotten milder

So long as I don't need to call a biohazard team, and I can just clean the blood up, then I'll be able to do it.

Do you have a good way to get a blood stain out of a rug

Oxyclean or peroxide like they say in the documentaries?

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Dab and press, don't rub. Dawn in cold water first dabbed on and soaked up with a towel, then hydrogen peroxide the same way for what's left had always worked for me.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago

Thank you very much, I appreciate it.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'm sorry for your loss and very sorry you had to go through that. The fact that you can still give the paramedics credit for doing their best is admirable and shows a rational mind is in control of your emotions- but it's okay to be pissed at them for being so inconsiderate and not respecting your grief. they could and should have done better.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 years ago

No, I agree. They did their best. I'm grateful for them. My main issue was that it was stuffed under the bed. I reached under it to see what it was and got covered in blood and fluids.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Woof. I’m sorry about your loss, I’m sorry you have to deal with their forgotten stuff, I’m sorry for everything you’re going to go through and have been going through.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 years ago

Thank you, yeah it hard. It was so sudden. Like we just went out to eat yesterday and we got his favorite meal, steak and potato.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'm sorry for your loss. My dad passed away ten years ago from Alzheimer's and I was not there for him (and he could not recognize me). You've done a fantastic job.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 years ago

My father had severed paranoid schizophrenia, so he was prone to breaking and losing all of my electrical devices. He kept thinking that the government was after him.

He escaped from my care last month and went missing, thinking that he was being chased. It was a state-wide search with a "silver alert" (it's like an amber alert for the old or disabled)

We found him in a coma about a week later about 100 miles from his house. He woke up rather quickly when they got him on his meds again, thankfully. So I moved him into my place 24/7

They released him into my care about two weeks ago, but I don't think his body could handle so much stress for so many years. They think him being afraid all the time just wore his heart down until his stopped today.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Call servpro. They can clean up bio hazard no problem. I did i myself a few years ago.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Thank you very much for the information

The thing that got me so confused over it was that it was stuffed under the bed. When my grandmother passed in Feb, they took all their trash with them.

I'm not going to put significant moral blame on the paramedics, but I wish they would have left the trash out for me at least to see.

Having to reach under the bed to see what was under there and getting my had covered in blood and other fluids seriously about made me vomit in shock alone.

I appreciate that they tried to save my father's life which is why I'm only mildly upset. I'm not wanting to "karen" them as I'm sure it was a mistake, and a weird one at that.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Thank you very much. This is something that I really needed to hear.

I feel like I'm walking through a fog, having to do the same things I did dealing with death stuff that I had to do for my grandmother not but 3 months ago.

I will for sure do that sort of meditation and I will see if it works. I'm sure it will as it seems like a good way to hack a memory...

Thank you so much for taking the time that you did to write that out for me.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

deleted by creator

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago

That's really unprofessional and I think that can also be dangerous (for pets and children if they get their hands on it). Also sorry for your dad.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 years ago

Press F to pay respects

[–] [email protected] -4 points 2 years ago

Unacceptable

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