653
Trump’s evidence of South Africa ‘white genocide’ contains images from Democratic Republic of Congo
(www.theguardian.com)
this post was submitted on 23 May 2025
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What about those that weren't from Congo?
The one was a picture of a large number of crosses which Trump said was a burial site for 1000s of white farmers, when it was in fact a memorial following the death of 2 farmers. The memorial was intended to represent all farm deaths of all races. Farm deaths are an issue but the victims are of all races - they kill the farmers, their families and the workers.
There was a video of a political leader singing a song that translates to "Kill the Boer" i.e. kill the white Afrikaans farmer. This video is: a) more than a decade old, b) from a rally of a minority opposition party i.e. not the political party of the people Trump was meeting, c) from a political party that has been losing votes in recent elections, led by someone who was expelled from the ruling party, d) is of a historic protest song from the apartheid era i.e. more than 30 years ago.
This video resulted in a court case, where the court concluded that a "reasonably well-informed person" would understand that when a protest song is sung "even by politicians, the words are not meant to be understood literally, nor is the gesture of shooting to be understood as a call to arms or violence."
This video was a big deal at the time but it's not current, not representative of the government's view, and the person depicted in it is increasingly being sidelined in South African politics.
While Trump is definitely exaggerating what's happening there, I think you're downplaying it a bit too much.
There were multiple videos, but the concerning part here is it looks like even in recent rallies Julius Malema has continued with this chant: https://web.archive.org/web/20250502020122/https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/02/world/africa/south-africa-kill-boer-song.html
It is ridiculous that there were no dates/locations for anything in these clips given what Trump is trying to claim here.
Yes, but it's worth pointing out that the EFF is still one of the more popular parties. The 3rd or 4th largest party from what I can tell based on this list (and from what other articles have mentioned). https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_political_parties_in_South_Africa
It is good to hear that someone like him is increasingly being sidelined.
Thanks for pointing out the court case. After a little digging it looks like the court has ruled on this more than once. Back in 2011 they found him guilty of hate speech for the chant: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-safrica-malema/south-africa-court-finds-malema-guilty-of-hate-speech-idUSTRE78B2DD20110912/
And in 2022 the courts ruled that the chant should not be taken literally.
That chant when coupled with statements to his supporters such as "never be afraid to kill" is still alarming.
It reeks of "it was just a joke, bro" energy and what fascists try to do when they are testing the waters.
As I said, the song was a really big deal when it happened, there was a massive outcry. I believe the incident took place in 2013, the year Malema founded his party. His platform absolutely runs on hatred of white people, and this was a way for him to gain political relevance.
The objections to Malema singing the song went through the courts, as they should, and Malema had to go all the way to the Supreme Court of Appeal. (The final judgement is from 2024.) I would assume that he sang it again after that but honestly try to ignore him as much as possible.
However, there was no point in Trump showing videos of Malema to the South African delegation. They had nothing to do with it. In fact, the ANC promised in 2012 never to sing that protest song again (it was originally one of their protest songs).
More importantly, this video is not evidence of a white genocide, past, present, or planned.
Edit to add: The reality is that there is a notable segment of the population that is angry. The economy is bad, unemployment is crazy high, electricity is insufficient (load shedding is a disaster), violent crime remains high, etc. It's easier for them to keep blaming white people than acknowledge that it's been 30 years of black rule now. Malema is a symptom of these issues. A meaningful discussion around this topic would have been valuable, but that's not what Trump did.
Such as?
This question really shouldn't be that hard to answer. Here's the video that was shown at the Whitehouse: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLDl3mblm-c
Video of the full meeting (I set the link to skip ahead to the part where the TV is brought in) if you want to see President Cyril Ramaphosa's reaction to it: https://odysee.com/@NTD:2/live-trump-holds-bilateral-meeting-2:5?t=1313
Besides the video of the crosses along the road, there are video clips of the Economic Freedom Fighter's leader, Julius Malema calling for a bloody revolution as well as chanting with large crowds to "kill the Boer" (white man/farmer).
There are no timestamps/locations for any of the video clips, but it looks like this guy founded the Economic Freedom Fighters back in 2013.
Edit: typo
Yeah, all of this is explained in the article.
Yes and you were the one asking the questions about things that are explained in the article so I responded with some context.
You've misread the conversation. I'm not the one asking for the obvious.
And i like your comment, btw, it's well written.
Please explain.
Edit: I see your edit... But I must still be misreading the conversation.
Even after double checking the username, you were the one that said, "Such as?"
I edited my reply a little.
The person i was talking to is the one that hasn't read the article and it's asking questions in bad faith. I was asking them to clarify what was confusing them, basically, Knowing they were asking in bad faith.
Seeing your edit:
Yes. Such as what are you talking about? Because the article clearly explained it. If you follow the conversation it's clear what i was asking for.
It doesn't matter. They're still denying trump lied about it, so I was right in my original assumptions of them.
Shared with me from a South African friend. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqvp1FOir4Y
Oops, you weren't supposed to ask about those.
Which ones are those? Care to point them out?
So far only one of them appeared to be from congo. What about the rest? Are we going to throw it all out because one was from Congo, and because a memorial mistaken for a burial site (literally makes no difference)
What are the other ones exactly?
That's what we're asking. Can you stop?
Im asking you which you're talking about. Everyone else already knows the answer.
"The evidence of supposed mass killings of white South Africans presented by Donald Trump in a tense White House meeting on Wednesday were in some cases images from the Democratic Republic of Congo, while footage shown during the meeting was falsely portrayed as depicting “burial sites”."
"In some cases" means less than a majorty of the cases. We're talking about the rest. Do you and "everyone else" know something about these other ones we don't?
When we know multiple pictures are bullshit it makes the rest of them questionable by default.
Yes, questionable. It doesn't make them false by default, and it doesn't mean anyone asking "what about the rest of them?" needs to be downvoted by the circlejerk mob. We're back at my point in my original comment.
Are you trying to claim the made up conspiracy theories about white genocide are in fact real?
Replacement theory is a conspiracy theory about white replacement in western countries, not a place where a real minority is the target of a large amount of hate. The South African minority white people have not ever been part of this conspiracy theory. Lumping them together is dangerous logic often used in genocide denial.
Is genocide happening? I don't know. If people are claiming to be victims, then it should be taken seriously even if they're white. So here we are, someone asked "what about the other ones", got downvoted, and people start arguing "no, it's not real" because a few of them weren't real.
"I'm just asking questions"
It is a legitimate question you're trying to label a conspiracy theory as if it was so extremely unlikely that the stack of paper trump held was nothing but all made up.
Labelling anything as "JAQ" is literally a supression tactic used by extremists and astroturfing corporations, by the way.
Imagine a place on the internet where at least one person asks "wait, what about this then?" and not being told "shut up. Don't ask questions, just consume the media the way we want you to."
Lemmy is not supposed to be a brainrot meme cave.
Then why are you here?
Ad hominem
As if what you said wasn't an attack.
Are you done crying about downvotes
You're falsely assuming it, and using it as justification.
Your comments speak for themselves.
Have a good night
Stop JAQing off in public you freak
Don't bother, these people didn't even bother to read the article
It's a government official making a claim based on easily verifiable bad evidence, so if the whole thing wasn't suspect before, it most certainly is now, right? Why should we give the benefit of the doubt? Not only has the administration not earned that right, they've shown over and over again that they don't extend that benefit to anyone else.
It fucking amazes me that we don't hold our leaders to a higher standard, and it worries me that people don't seem to want to.
If it is easily verifiable, then how about we verify it right now? So what about those other cases not from Congo?
Because people are dead, and it is the choice between "ingore" or "start and investigation"
I agree trump is a hack, but I want to know about those other cases.
Try reading the article for starters.
I did read it. It is one of those articles with a clear political bias, trying to spin the story as if all of it is false because one thing was false. Anyone eating it up is doing so because they either can't think for themselves or don't want to.
Are you done following me around in this thread?
Ah so you're just a lie spreading propagandist
Ad hominem
Pointing out what you're doing is not attacking you.
Where did I lie? Where is my propaganda? You're labelling me as such without any evidence. That's an attack on me, not my argument. It is utterly pathetic behavior from someone who moderates communities. We're done here.
Yes, when someone says have a good night it means you're done.