this post was submitted on 21 Feb 2025
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Hi folks! I'm here with another idea. Let's make an amazon alternative. I know! I know! That was asked for a couple times already but lets discuss some details.

Amazon is basically glorified dropshipping by now. What if we just made federated (not sure if over activitypub would work) ads and sales, powered by fediseer (the "trust" network of the fediverse).

Example 1: So you buy at toms groceries, you trust them. they have experience with tina's hardware store and they trust them. so you can buy both toms and tinas wares on both sites.

Example 2: So for example, I run a small business that sells computers. You run a small business that sells mice and keyboards. I have worked with you before so I mark you as trusted in my local website, which federates with yours, showing your products in my shop. If a customer buys my computer and buys your keyboard on top, my site sends you a buy order with customer address and payment. I get a small fee for my electricity of say 1%.

Can someone try and poke holes in this idea? It feels like this could work!

Have a nice weekend.

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[–] NaibofTabr@infosec.pub 4 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I think there's some misunderstanding here. Amazon is a massive logistics system. The retail storefront is a tiny part of what Amazon is today.

AWS exists because Amazon needed to solve an internal data handling problem in order to solve their logistics problems so that they could scale up. After building that system, they started selling it as a product to other businesses. The point being, Amazon's real success is based on providing business-to-business services. The retail website is the tiny public-facing bit, but it depends on the rest of the organization structure in order to operate properly.

What you're proposing is more like an eBay alternative, where the system is basically just the storefront, and the sellers listing products are responsible for their own logistics. eBay still provides dispute resolution for buyers though, and that's hard to achieve without some centralized control.

There's also the legal problems. At some point someone will use such a system as a silk road - probably sooner rather than later. Whoever is administrating and hosting it will be liable for criminal activity in the countries where the crime occurs. It will not end well.

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 3 points 1 month ago (11 children)

Thats entirely possible. Thanks for pointing it out.

But the rest about amazon is (interesting?) noise in my opinion. The thing keeping people locked in amazon is amazon, nothing else. Sellers need to sell there to survive and customers cant find alternatives, especially not for a competitive price.

[–] HubertManne@moist.catsweat.com 3 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I don't see how you think its noise. Many items from amazon come from an amazone warehouse and delivered by amazon. they don't exclusively do it this way but this is how they have the same day and few day shipping. I remember when amazon went from mostly being a book site to selling everything and people were gaga about 2 day shipping and when same day shipping came to some metros it was talked about a lot. I think the main thing is the other guy mentioned logistics and aws but forgot to mention the warehouse and shipping part of the logistics.

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 2 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Your point - in general - is valid but what does it have to do with the idea of federated dropshipping?

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[–] MyOpinion@lemm.ee 4 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Or you can just buy from other online retailers.

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[–] rottingleaf@lemmy.world 4 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

No, federated model is chosen over distributed model or centralized model to allow feuds, putting it simply.

That may work for a Reddit alternative, but doesn't work for markets. Helps moderation (some idea of it, I don't think that idea is good), but definitely hurts a single space to sell and buy stuff.

Which is why cryptobros and such types make either centralized or distributed systems.

So much for using computer networks for this.

Now about Amazon specifically - your post omits the whole warehouses and logistics part. Which is most of Amazon's core business.

Computer people today somehow started forgetting that real life is very hard and complex. When I was a kid (born 1996, so not old man), computers had a promise of making that real life easier, and from time to time delivered on it, but at some point bullshit like glossy buttons and Web 2.0 and social media became a thing in itself, and everyone started behaving as if it's done, we now can look down like olympic gods to those mortals messing around in dirt, and sometimes easily solve their problems. We can't.

Getting back to logistics - one has to design a system of shared warehouses, transportation, mailing and delivery tasks, tracking, reporting on outcomes of every event, and all that should be even more abuse-resilient than the processes inside actual Amazon. You'll have Byzantine problems in every interaction.

The "distributed king of all social media, solving once and for all the problem of centralized platforms" that I'm often dreaming about is realistic compared to that.

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 4 points 1 month ago (6 children)

Your comment brings no ounce of new ideas or criticisms to the table, overlooks all the pros and cons already mentioned and assumes you know a lot more thane for example. I run businesses for 15 years, do ethical business since 10 yrs and am thinking from a position of experience.

The reason I dont present myself in a way that screams competence is because this is lemmy and we dont need this stuff. I like spitballing ideas and push new projects for the benefit of the people.

But feel free to suggest constructive things.

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[–] muntedcrocodile@lemm.ee 3 points 1 month ago (11 children)

I love the idea of federate Amazon. The obvious choice would be to implement Monero as the "reserve currency" integrate with decentralise xmr exchanges and escrow services. U would do some sort of seller raring from consumers giving reviews tied to a purchase transaction on the blockchain.

Also imagine the possibilities if for services could federate (most likely only with eachother). If this gets built it will be the final form of the free market. No borders no laws no restrictions no censorship no taxes. It would be chaos. The end of wall street as we know it, and from its ashes shall rise a libertarian phoenix.

[–] x4740N@lemm.ee 3 points 1 month ago

OK Crypto Scammer

Also, FUCK TRANSPHOBES

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 2 points 1 month ago

I like your enthusiasm. Not too sure if I would go so far but I can see how one would think about it this way. No disagreeing from my side. I'll keep monero and other things like gnu taler in mind for a payment system. Thanks for participating.

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[–] vxx@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I like the idea and it could work very well for smaller communities. In fact, theyre already doing something similar called "Werbering" (advertising ring) in germany. It takes the idea and elevates it into the digital space.

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 3 points 1 month ago

Thats an interesting bit of information. Thanks! :)

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