this post was submitted on 08 Jul 2025
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HASE BIKES PINO 2021 - das neue Pino (youtu.be)
submitted 21 hours ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
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If money was no object, this would be the bike I'd throw my wallet at!

Not only does the tandem setup look better than a traditional tandem, but to be able to convert it into a front-loading cargo bike is... WOW!

This bike is also Made in Germany.

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[–] [email protected] 2 points 17 hours ago* (last edited 17 hours ago) (1 children)

I own a Hase Pino Tour (the "tour" part is important), and it's my daily commuter/cargo hauler. It's ... okay. For the money, I'd buy another Bilenky Viewpoint, and I had a lot of beefs with Bilenky and the whole process of dealing with them.

I'll spare you the stories of why I sold the Bilenky and later bought the Pino. But I have a lot of experience with both and bought both of them new/custom ordered.

In no particular order:

  • Custom bike, custom problems: Bilenky are handmade custom bikes and the Pino is a custom production bike. Both have all kinds of persnickety issues, some of which might chap your ass or not.
  • Almost everything on the Pino is proprietary: the linked steering adapter, the stoker chain tensioner, the stoker "freewheel" mechanism, the captain cockpit, the stoker seat, even the goddamned handlebars... And most of these components are obviously built to a price point, rather than a quality level. Want something different in your cranks and cockpit? Good fucking luck.
  • Hase Pino accessories are mostly overpriced garbage. I have the midship pannier rack and porteur bag. Installing either is a huge pain in the dick. The shop warned me that it would be a terrible experience and that they charge accordingly.
  • The porteur bag seems great at first. But then you realize the stoker seat is no longer available unless you completely remove the bag. And it has shit weather resistance.
  • The midship pannier rack is beyond stupid. It is supposed to be able to hold two Ortlieb front roller panniers per side. Well, only if you have tiny feet, are willing to bend your panniers, and don't need to get into those panniers. Like ever. It's such a pain to use the rack that I completely changed how my Pino is laid out. I'd rather use my Burley Travoy trailer.
  • The Spinner fork is garbage, but in Hase's defense, there is maybe one suspension fork in the size that doesn't completely suck. Still, for as many proprietary parts as are on this $12000 bike, I expect better.
  • The stoker seat is narrow, has poor adjustment range, and bad ergonomics. The seat angle is incorrect for every stoker I had. Reclining the stoker back angle interferes with steering. And it's just plain uncomfortable.
  • The wheelbase is much too short and the steerer tube location relative to the stoker COG is all wrong. And that's some voodoo, because the Viewpoint steerer is under the stoker's ass, whereas it's in front of the stoker on the Pino. This makes the Pino very twitchy, especially with a stoker that's looking around as the semi-recumbent design intended (!). And despite having too short of a wheelbase, the turning radius is enormous. My Viewpoint had something like 30% more wheelbase yet 50% less turning radius.
  • There is a lot of lash in the Pino linked steering. I keep futzing with it, but I can't get the last bit of lash out of it.
  • There are so ridiculous, stupid design issues. For example, bottle cage braze-ons? Ha! One set for the captain. On a loaded touring bike! And that's it for the bike. No place for a handlebar bag. No stoker water bottle braze-ons. Sure, this is all mitigable, but come on.

If the Pino were a $4000 bike and not designed by Germans, I'd cut it a lot more slack. But at the price they sell these things, I have a lot of caveats for anyone considering one.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

Thank you so much for the insight!

Bilenky Viewpoint

Every day, I learn about a new gem.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 hours ago

I loved my Bilenky. But that's a bucket of its own issues. Cons:

  • Bilenky. The timeline on the build was originally stated at 3 months; it was delivered 14 months later. Fine, whatever. The stoker boom was welded ~1 degree off-center. That's the kind of thing nobody would notice. The person to whom I sold could barely notice it even after I pointed it out, but it stuck in my craw.
  • The price. My Viewpoint was $11,000USD in 2014. I sold it for $8000 and the buyer didn't even balk. They drove from Minnesota to Washington to buy it because price and timeline.
  • The midship rack. When I bought my Viewpoint, Haulin' Collin was the only person making the midship rack and center kickstand. He's a custom bike fab shop in Seattle. The price and timelines are what one would expect for custom. But his work is impeccable.
  • It's huge. But you don't buy any tandem if you live in a small apartment. You need a place to keep this. It was still slightly shorter than my diamond tandem though.

Pros:

  • Bilenky. The design of the Viewpoint is well-trod and tightly refined, having been pioneered in the Counterpoint Opus. Bilenky's version is dialed.
  • Their paint! OMG, their paint is easily one of the best I experienced.
  • Generic parts selection. Whatever you want, you can get it spec'd. Want to change something? No problem.
  • Independent stoker drivetrain. The stoker can select their own cadence. Unless one is an experienced tandem captain, one might not think this is a that big of a deal. Absolutely buy this option.
  • S&S Couplers. If you go with this option, the bike fits into two airline-standard cases. Although it took me two hours to pack it up. And it does limit your component selections a bit.
  • Generic recumbent seat. If your stoker wants different ergo, it's easily accommodated.
  • Generic two-legged kickstands work just fine for the bike, but you won't be sitting on the seat with one of those.
  • Rides great solo. This applies to all semi-recumbents. Riding a diamond tandem solo can be risky; the rear wheel wants to slide out in turns.

Another bit on the Hase Pino: if riding solo and without cargo on the front, the front wheel tends to wash out. No bueno. It's cornering capabilities are a scant fraction of the Viewpoint.