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Just FYI, most "gender-affirming surgery" in the below 18 group is males having their moobs removed because male boobs are usually a source of social problems like being bullied in school. This will mostly affect straight young cis men if we're going purely by the numbers.
So like, be as bigoted as you want, but don't pretend to be informed on the subject just because you feel like jumping on the right wing bandwagon.
Really? Cause most people I've seen defend it, even in this thread, have been about hormone blockers and whatnot
On a statistical basis, really.
Trans people are a small minority compared to fat teenage boys.
Obviously this is aimed against trans people, so there's a clear difference in how it's received and it clearly affects trans people more politically, but according to numbers most gender affirming surgeries are indeed on cis males.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11211955/
Puberty blockers are maybe considered gender affirming care legally, idk, but technically it's the opposite of affirming. You can't use puberty blockers forever afaik, but you can use them to delay your decision possible gender affirming care until you're ready to make the decision. And with that sort of use, they've proven to be quite safe and effective.
We let children have medical care
Gender affirming care is medical care
But where do you draw the line of gender affirming care?
Is giving a teenage boy a bigger dick gender affirming care, and therefore essential medical care? What about a girl who's flat chested wanting bigger boobs? I know it's weird to ask and I do feel kinda gross but yeah. Is that too far? What about an athlete who wants to take steroids cause it would help them achieve their ideal body?
I'm genuinely not trying to be rude. I just, if you give the life altering drugs to one group of kids, where do you draw the line? What about kids who clearly need to hit a joint and chill but it's illegal cause they're underage? I don't think it's fair to give one group more privileges regardless of how they feel.
If my grandma had wheels?
None of these are mostly reversible treatments with negligible long term impacts that are common with trans minors.
None of thee are also connected to issues that cause intense mental health issues, including suicidal ideation AND can be treated by your proposed suggestions.
You're comparing completely incomparable situations that look similar at face value without thinking about them for just a minute.
Cis people don't kill themselves over body issues? Only trans people can be fucked up mentally?
Posting like this just makes you seem dishonest.
If you really wanna talk about this drop me a discord handle in dms, I don't feel like typing out long form forum messages.
I'm not a doctor, so I don't.
Drawing the line is easy: Can the procedure be delayed without any life long consequences? If yes, you can wait until you're an adult.
You want bigger boobs? That's fine, but in the end, it doesn't make a difference whether you do it as a 14 years or as an adult. You can wait 4 more years.
You want steroids to achieve a more muscular body? That's your choice, but it won't harm you to wait another few years, you will still have enough time to achieve and enjoy your ideal body when you are an adult.
You don't want to undergo male puperty? Okay, time to act now, because you will suffer irreversable consequences if we do nothing.
Your argument fails to take into account that any person seeking to change their gender will not get any gender afferming treatment from medical professionsals, without a lot of therapy, psychological, and medical assessment. These kids don't just go up to their parents and say "I want boobs" or "I want a penis" and mom calls up the family doc to schedule the appointment.
Your whole argument hinges of this conservative boogeyman thinking that any kid can just walk up to their lib parents and magic up a full gender reassignment surgery. And your example of girl asking her parents for bigger boobs would probably be denied by any reputable cosmetic surgeon.
Let's be real: that type of total transition medical care is astronomically expensive and heavily gated by the professional medical community/industry. So how 'bout we leave those decisions to these kids, their families, and the qualified medical professionals?
You're not a bad guy, but this is kind of a bad faith argument, saying that a 14yo not being comfortable with their gender is just a phase they'll grow out of (like any other stupid kid / teenager phase). Does it happen? sure, of course it does. But it's not 'just a phase' for the VAST majority of trans pre adults. If you're scared that someone will change their mind and keep them from doing anything until 18, then they get hit with full wrong gender puberty and change their bodies in ways they can't undo. Most of the older trans women I know transitioned in adulthood, and it sucks to say but they still sound like a dude talking. They hate it. They wish so bad they could have been allowed to do this as early as possible. They knew exactly what was going on, but had to wait. It's up to parents to know their kids and say are you sure? are you SURE? REALLY? yeah? ok cool let's do this then. Why make them suffer longer?
Ok, but where do you draw the line? Is it ok to treat non trans kids for gender affirming care? How far do you let it go?
Non-trans kids who want extreme changes to their body go to the same doctor that trans kids do: a psychotherapist and/or psychiatrist.
No one just getting any of your example body mods without serious psychological evaluation, even adults.
Nah, nobody here has been talking about psycotherapist. If that was all it was, everything would be cool. This is about body modifications. Which no kid should be doing. Leave it till 18
Talk to therapists all you want
And no one is getting that kind of body modifications without talking to one first. Your ignorance of the medical community is on full display.
Then you need to pay attention. They lie about surgery and ban the therapy and puberty blocking medications.
Absolute yes, puberty blockers weren't even invented for trans kids. Early puberty is a thing and a problem that's treated using puberty blockers, the same that a trans person would use.
My son nearly had to go on puberty blockers, as he was starting to show signs of early puberty. We talked to our pediatrician, who ultimately determined that he's not starting puberty just yet. Turns out he's just a really rambunctious and rowdy 8 year old.
None of that is anywhere close to what's happening.
They give them a pill to temporarily block puberty. The point is to keep them from feeling severe mental anguish at their body developing the wrong way while they get years of therapy before a surgery.