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World won’t forget Tiananmen Square, US and Taiwan say on 36th anniversary of massacre
(www.theguardian.com)
this post was submitted on 04 Jun 2025
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My favorite thing to do is to watch liberals read the (very western biased) Wikipedia article on this event. The moment when they realize how many soldiers were killed before the crackdown is always radicalizing for those with even a modicum of intellectual curiosity.
This sounds like how conservatives rationalize the Kent State massacre by claiming that the protesters were throwing feces.
You're not radicalized. You just switched which authoritarian you swear fealty to.
It would be different if the protesters had lynched a dozen soldiers before they responded.
Of course given the context of the Vietnam war, the soldiers wouldn't have been justified even if the protesters killed some of them first; you don't get to claim self-defense when you yourself are only there to put down a protest against imperialism.
I guess the Chinese soldiers were minding their own business at home with their families, and not there to just put down protests against authoritarianism.
See the big difference is the US was murdering countless Vietnamese to keep them under the boot of capitalism. The protesters in Tienanmen aren't as black and white. If the protesters were protesting China poisoning the food supply and massacring countless villages of country on the other side of the planet to keep a country's resources easy to exploit and their people's blood ready to be spent keeping other countries under the boot of capitalism, it would be that simple, but they weren't.
Also "against authoritarianism" lmao you are a literal child.
Most rational people oppose authoritarianism.
Here, it'll take two minutes to read this. I'm not even going to get into the contexts "authoritarianism" is and isn't used today (hint: liberals use it and see no hypocrisy).
do you think this is convincing, compelling? it is not.
it totally equates the democratic delegation of agency to elected delegates for a specific term and purpose with permanent subservience.
it's an attack on strawmen, and you're a born bootlicker if you're this easily swayed into cheerleading for authoritarians.
Always funny to hear people call folks in China brainwashed and then have this "I'll never deviate from the American Party line" when it comes to foreign affairs.
Brains like a steel trap. Nothing gets in.
lmao i've never been near the usa, swing and a miss, bootlicker.
can guarantee i've done more for working people as a union steward and negotiator than you ever will as a terminally online whiner.
Yeah Engels take on authoritarianism is dated and not really valid given that his ideologies do not result in anything other than authoritarian states IRL.
I'm always curious to compare how Americans view the Tianemen Square incident with Waco.
Like, if you ask an American to explain what happened at Waco, you'll get a bunch of blank stares. A few people with anti-government views will explain how a religious community was ruthlessly butchered by the Gestapo-like FBI. A few people with anti-religious views will insist this was a child sex cult that committed suicide while the FBI tried to help.
But for the most part, those Americans who remember it just see it as another normal police action against people who were probably committing all sorts of crimes.
You could also talk about the BLM protests from '14 to '18, and how the broad American view was that this was police acting to protect private property. And maybe some of the protesters didn't deserve such rough treatment, but hey they knew what they signed up for when they blocked traffic.
But the views on Tianemen are uniform. Chinese killed that nice man with their tank and then killed everyone else in the city and then covered it up in a way only people in China are unaware it happened.
"Chinese government killed their own people, it's fine! They are basically property"
Wasn't the problem that their families were part of the protesters? That's why reinforcements from outside the city (without family ties) were called in.
Reminds me of Hillsborough and “some fans”.
I only see wiki reference 10 soldiers having died - is this the number you're referring to?
Do you think that's alot? In my head that's disproportionately few compared to the [disputed] 100s of civilians that the Chinese government declared dead
According to the linked page with PLA/PAP casualties, there were 15 verifiable deaths (PRC official number is 23). Half of them weren't directly caused by the protesters, and the other half occurred after troops first opened fire. Truly, I feel quite radicalized.
Consider yourself both radicalised and owned liberal! /s
Can you share that link? I'm curious how the 7 "non directly caused by protesters" died. They just had a random accident? Lovers quarrel? Food poisoning?
PLA/PAP Casualties
Summary is a truck flipped over, supposed friendly fire incident with a non-uniformed soldier, and a heart attack.
According to the official numbers there were ten civilians killed for every state agent of oppression.
I upvoted you, but a source for that statistic would still be nice.
The wikipedia article on the incident was my source.
That's a pretty big article.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1989_Tiananmen_Square_protests_and_massacre
Can you be more specific? Then I can confidentiality repeat your fact.
“On 19 June, Beijing Party Secretary Li Ximing reported to the Politburo that the government's confirmed death toll was 241, including 218 civilians (of which 36 were students), 10 PLA soldiers, and 13 People's Armed Police, along with 7,000 wounded”
under “Death Toll”
Thanks
Liberals are hardly better than the conservatives in the US. They all seem to be naive right wingers.
Killing the villainous authoritarian ork creature CCP is always virtuous and good and needs to be celebrated.
Stopping a tank in front of an unarmed bicyclist until police pull him out of the way is unforgivable genocide.
I had to do it, these people don't even read their own fake sources.