this post was submitted on 07 Jul 2024
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[–] [email protected] 174 points 11 months ago (6 children)

Tankies are fascists, so this isn’t surprising.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 11 months ago (8 children)

To place Russian communism and Nazi-fascism on the same moral plane, in that both would be totalitarian, is superficial at best, fascism at worst. Whoever insists on this equation may well consider himself a democrat, in truth and in the bottom of his heart he is in fact already a fascist, and certainly only in a hypocritical and insincere way will he fight fascism, while reserving all his hatred for communism.

  • Thomas Mann
[–] [email protected] 59 points 11 months ago

NO U

Stunning. Incredible take.

Also they said fascism, not nazi-fascism. Tankies aren't nazis. They excuse completely different genocides than the holocaust.

[–] [email protected] 34 points 11 months ago

Russia is an oligarchy, not a communist state. Where have you been since the 1990s?

[–] [email protected] 17 points 11 months ago (1 children)

They said tankies, not Russian communism.

Everybody knows russian communism is marginally better than fascism, except those who survived it and fascistly say it's as bad.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

It's true because Thomas said it?

Edit: Nice downvotes but I would actually like to know his reasoning.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago

Poignant, thanks.

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Lol that is such stupid nonsense wtf 😂

[–] [email protected] 28 points 11 months ago

Found the tankie

[–] [email protected] 21 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (14 children)

Tankies are not fascist, they are just willing to do whatever it takes to defend the socialist revolution.

[–] [email protected] 120 points 11 months ago (1 children)

If you're willing to do "whatever it takes" including instituting fascism, you're a fascist.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

A socialist revolution by definition cannot be fascist, fascism is a far right movement and a socialist revolution is far left movement they both have authoritarian aspects, but are polar opposites as far as the goals of each movement. Socialism is for the benefit of all, fascism is for the benefit of the few.

Also I'm not an accelerationist and am voting for Biden, there is no where near enough class conciousness in the States for a Prolitariat Revolution to occur, but once that critical tipping point is reached I think Landlords and Billionaires should get the wall if they refuse to peacefully give up their hordes of wealth and property for the common good and that the revolution should be defended by any means necessary.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 11 months ago (5 children)

Fine, I will grant you, you aren't fascists. Fascists hate people and want to kill them.

Tankies love "the revolution" more than the people they want to benefit. You may not see it as breaking a few eggs to make an omelette, but when you sit out an election where the fascists have a better than coin flip odds of seizing power, you are effectively letting them do that. And if you're willing to let trans people die in camps for... what was it? "Enough class consciousness to build" then... well, fuck you and your revolution.

Like, also this reveals your total all encompassing privilege. Because look dude, if the fascists are putting trans people and immigrants into camps, do you really think they will spare you? Or do you just think you're white enough that you'll go under the radar until your "revolution" happens?

Also, fuck any revolution that involves taking up the tools and institutions of power. Those need to be ground to dust

[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Tankies are like NRA lunatics that dream with the chance to shoot somebody, but are scared to try alone.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago (6 children)

I'm not sure about that; I think a lot of radicalizing discourse of late comes from the same place. Life under late stage capitalism is hard, and people are not sure why, nor can they articulate it. And they can tell it's getting worse. Its a rife breeding ground for fascists, but when you hit leftist spaces, the tankies have the biggest net. You'll be greeted by r/socialism, and find yourself in its web of subs. You might get pulled in by a Gravel Institute video (especially since you might be aware of Prager U and are interested in a video from the other end). It might be Chapo Trap House. And a lot of entry points into Tankie spaces are extremely compelling. For a lot of people, it will be the first anti Imperial talking points they will ever hear, with no liberal "but this is the greatest nation" filter.

I think this content is actually good and useful. The USA is guilty of myriad atrocities that its citizenry doesn't know about, or the full depth, or doesn't think about in order to get through their daily life.

But then after you get past that, the Tankie reveals himself to be "Anti Nato" without an cohesive political or moral position, in a very "politics as a team sport" kind of way. Russia is a moderately sized challenger to NATO, so they love it. It is also a successor state to a Red Empire. Ukraine is NATO making overtures to NATO, so they don't like it. Israel is an imperialist NATO outpost, and they are committing a genocide, so of course they don't like it, but so many tankies have shown their whole ass diving into Antisemitism, making fun of Jewish names, or Jewish influence on policy, that Ive exited most of the tankie spaces I was still in. Antizionism is not antisemitism, and they are antisemites.

But compare that to China, where they deny a genocide because it is being perpetrated by the largest challenger to NATO and still nominally communist state in the world, and you have your answer.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 11 months ago (1 children)

the Tankie reveals himself to be “Anti Nato” without an cohesive political or moral position

Opposition to NATO is a cohesive political position. We're happy to explain our views when people are willing to hear us out, generally though, people just want to put nonsense into our mouths and then call us nonsensical.

but so many tankies have shown their whole ass diving into Antisemitism, making fun of Jewish names, or Jewish influence on policy, that Ive exited most of the tankie spaces I was still in. Antizionism is not antisemitism, and they are antisemites.

As usual about accusations towards tankies, there's no link. Show your receipts or stop making stuff up.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 11 months ago (1 children)

"Opposition to NATO is a cohesive political position. We're happy to explain our views when people are willing to hear us out, generally though, people just want to put nonsense into our mouths and then call us nonsensical."

Why are you opposed to NATO?

[–] [email protected] 7 points 11 months ago

Because NATO defends a system of neocolonialism that's responsible for the bulk of global poverty.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago

But compare that to China, where they deny a genocide because it is being perpetrated by the largest challenger to NATO and still nominally communist state in the world, and you have your answer.

In fairness most people deny the genocide claims made by the anti=China think-tanks.

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[–] [email protected] 83 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Such as justifying capitalist oligarchs that pretend to be socialists like Putin and Xi.

Actually, Putin doesn't even pretend to be socialist. He's pretty unashamedly capitalist. Tankies love the guy anyway.

[–] [email protected] 51 points 11 months ago (8 children)

Funny how the self-proclaimed vanguard of the radical left are just incoherent anti-western reactionaries wearing Marxism like a fig leaf, isn't it? Like, I'm all for breaking down the current neoliberal capitalist hegemony, but you've gotta have a hole in your head to want to replace it with a literal crime syndicate masquerading as a government or an oppressive hyper-capitalist dictatorship with imperialistic ambitions.

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[–] [email protected] 59 points 11 months ago

Tankies don't give a fuck about socialism.

[–] [email protected] 52 points 11 months ago

Tankies, just like other fascists, are willing to do whatever it takes to gain and keep power, including pretending to support socialism

[–] [email protected] 32 points 11 months ago (1 children)

If I was to give this point of the benefit of the doubt (which, to be clear, I don't) what you're saying is that tankies are accelerationists. And I get it, to an extent -- a comfortable middle class isn't going to be concerned about the depredations of the right until they start to find themselves in the crosshairs -- but the last time fascists got their way in the world, more than 73 million people died. Arguing, in effect, that the aftermath of another world war will be better for the survivors is a... challenging point to defend when it requires you to dismiss the deaths of a significant percentage of the world's population, especially when those most in danger from a rising right wing are those that a supposed left-winger should most want to protect. Sacrificing religious, ethnic, and sexual minorities on the altar of a better future for religious, ethnic, and sexual minorities doesn't sit well with me.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Defending a revolution is not accelerationism. I have no idea how you got that from what they said, or generally where this idea of tankies being accelerationists comes from, it seems to be mostly something people make up about us. Accelerationism is stupid and reactionary.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (11 children)

Accelerationism is stupid and reactionary

So is Donald Trump.

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[–] [email protected] 28 points 11 months ago

Whatever it takes including sending tanks after people because they don't agree with your rule or am I missing something? Tankies is literally authoritarian or do you mean that your ideology is different and you want people to stop calling you that?

[–] [email protected] 22 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

You have a choice between 1) capitalism that's free for all, fuck the earth, fuck the workers, fuck the consumer, disband the EPA, OSHA, FTC, or 2) capitalism that's regulated, with environmental protection, worker protections, minimum wages, workplace standards, product regulations, etc. The choice should be obvious.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 11 months ago

Such as allying with the fascists so hard that Stalin was in talks to join the axis before Barbarossa.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 11 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 11 months ago (3 children)

Stalinism wasn't counter-revolutionary?

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 11 months ago (1 children)

If they're voting for Biden then why are they saying they won't vote for Biden and are encouraging others not to vote for Biden? 🤔

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 11 months ago

Lol, which is why historically they have coalitioned with the right to murder the socialists before the socialists could take power.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago

project 2025 is not a socialist revolution

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