This - please report people who are using the platform to expouse their hate, unnecessary misogyny (unless that's what you're into...) or are just generally trolls.

Also, if moderators are the ones encouraging, taking part, or otherwise ignoring it, please let an administrator know so we can try to resolve it.

These fuckin guys, what shitheads. I wish this era of our country was just over, I am NOT looking forward to 2024 election

Glad you’re here! Loved you on Reddit, hopefully lemmynsfw can be your new home!

I'd like to add that we are specifically looking into improved community identification methods. One on the table is a "nsfw+" concept for topics that may not be "mainstream" but aren't "illegal" - scat, pee, hentai beast, etc. These we would rather not show "on the main feed" or maybe even not federate, but we're not opposed to hosting. It's just that we want to make the instance appealing to the regular person. For those who want their "extreme" content - as long as it's legal, I think we all agree we don't necessarily mind it.

I'm open to hearing the community on this. With that said, "loli/shota" content where the object of eroticism is specifically that "they are a prepubescent child" will never be allowed. Don't start with that.

This is probably going to upset you to hear, but NSFWusername wasn't contributing to anything except demanding we allow loli/shota, telling people that the instance was failing, and telling them to go to the other instance to have more freedom.

Overall, we're fine with advertising other instances, but that instance has been problematic for us, and right now we need to focus. I've asked the team to stop using decades long bans, I've adjusted NSFWusername to just 7 days so that everyone can have a chance to cool off. I've also asked for better reasons on ban/purge/deletion.

Frankly, we're just not interested in the discussion of "how to be more like burggit" - we just need to do our thing the best we can. That bridge has kinda been burned for now, we can revisit rebuilding relationships once we get our feet under us and feel like the instance is in a better place.

"Council" is the wrong word, and even "admins" is wrong.

The "General Staff" room is where this has been taking place, with the "Technical" room discussing much of the logistics, code, and law.

Gavi is "head admin" as chosen by Yay, this is a role lemmy has in the backend. As a result, he is effectively that. Mike is very knowledgeable about the adult industry and I think we all value his input and his perspective. I have assumed somewhat of "head sysadmin" role for now, but we'll see how long that stays. Yay is still the owner, and the rest are members who basically responded to Yay's initial plea for help or otherwise reached out and were accepted. At this point we have a couple folks that aren't really active anymore, so it's hard to say.

But we will debate until we feel like we are on the same page, and then the plan is to bring it to the community for feedback. That seems like the only way this can work. Time will tell how successful we are.

"Biased against hentai" is a bit unfair - "inexperienced, concerned, and unsure" is better. I mean, look at this wikipedia page, it's enormous and there's so much distinction between countries. Basically we need to enforce different rules for different geographies, and this is a legal and technical nightmare.

I feel like there's an air of suspicion that the admins (I guess myself included, except I really don't want to consider myself an admin outside of infra and code) are not being truthful. I think padded was frustrated, and that happens when you debate about something you're passionate about. I don't blame him, we all make mistakes and overreact, myself and the other admins included.

But here's what happened. I'm eastern US timezone, so all this was between at 7pm-1am for me after an already long day, but never the less, we engaged in debate over the rules for over 5 hours straight. For context, Yay sent a screenshot that he woke up to over 1500 messages from us. I went to sleep at 1 and conversations continued.

It started with Mike proposing (what some of us felt were) draconian rules. I typically stay out of the "general admin" room, but gavi asked me to come give feedback. so I did and we all started discussing them. After about 2.5 hours of debate (probably like 930pm), Mike asked for people to use an emoji to show how they feel about them, the result was 2 thumbs up (gavi, mike) and 2 thumbs down (me, padded) - OUT OF 14 PEOPLE. It was not "a vote" - it was purely to gauge sentiment. And all it did was draw more discussion, almost no one even put a reaction except mike, gavi, me, and padded.

Padded got heated during the discussion and said he felt like he was repeating himself, even though I was agreeing with him and that's kinda just how hard debates go. Eventually, I made it clear that I would not sysadmin a database of people's IDs who want to post on this instance. Others chimed-in in agreement. The idea was dead before it started. it was also pointed out repeatedly that the tools would never exist to enforce "source only" and padded made good points that "sourced" content can be faked with a PH logo pasted over it.

His last message was this:

Then almost immediately after that I said this:

In my opinion, padded seemed unhappy with everything, it felt like his stance was that if we didn't allow it all then we shouldn't allow anything and we have no right being the "lemmynsfw" instance. So then padded posted summaries of the draft that no one agreed to, and then got banned with a shitty message in the modlog and the post purged as a reactionary response. Mike got reprimanded for the ban message, we regretted purging it, but what's done is done. TBH based on the way purging works I imagine it's still available on other instances if you really care. But we can't "unpurge" messages, we SHOULDN'T change modlog messages.

But after he left, the conversation turned to how do we handle, and what are our legal responsibilities relating to, CSAM , how do we geoblock virginia/utah/etc, whether loli hentai can get any of us in trouble, how do we even define "loli", how do we handle "extreme" content on the feed, and how do we determine if CNC is actually CNC and not NC.

And that's basically still where we are still now, but we've made progress and I think we're all getting on the same page. The past few nights I've been digging into lemmy code, including the pict-rs library, to figure out exactly how purging content works, how the federation aspect works, and what changes we need to make our instance safe from legal repercussions, and protect other instances from hosting content they may not be comfortable with.

Regarding purges, the only remaining piece after a purge is in the "admin_purge_log" table which lists the post id, the creator_id, the admin_id, the given reason, and the timestamp. This data is viewable from the "admin view" of the instance, but not to regular users. I don't believe purges are federated.

Our instance has purged 8 posts, 3 of which were test posts, 1 was padded's, and 4 others were before I was involved so I don't actually know. I assume it's involved with the de-federation ordeal.

That's the long and short of it. Please remember, Reddit had billions of dollars to pay lawyers to deflect any liability. We don't. I believe our current donation total is like $200 last we talked, probably more now, and the server costs were like $80 for june and expected to be much higher for July. We're discussing going out of pocket to get a lawyer. I think a more detailed account of finances will be shared soon.

The finalized content policy will be shared soon for feedback and then hopefully implemented. We're working on how to be more transparent with communications, server costs, and donations.

This shit is hard, I don't get why people want to dismiss it as a simple thing. People have gone to jail over this kind of content, and even if we could win in trial, none of us want it to ever come to that.

I just want to write code, lol

We will. The current team has been relentless, even with everyone across the globe, we all wake up to 100+ messages about the technical, legal, and content aspects. It's pretty cool to see happen

But still, it's just hard.

While that would be nice, it brings an entire other headache, including the issue that most content outside of OF and gonewild is copyrighted. We want to adhere to any dmca notices, but once you start making money off something the issue becomes even greater.

I would rather we just keep it volunteer based. It's not like we're doing much infrastructure work beyond keeping servers online and some minor codebase adjustments.

Tbh I think things will settle down soon, the newest rule draft I've seen is pretty fair and not at all what you might have read earlier today (which was literally a first draft proposed by one person that we were all debating, we're now on draft 3 or 4). In general, we're still researching laws and requirements so we don't want to commit to anything yet.

So I'm not really an "admin" - I'm a sysadmin/developer who was given the role of admin so I can make sure all systems (including modlog, reportings, and other tools) work as we adjust them for this instance's very specific needs.

Padded got banned because he was trying to sabotage the efforts of an entirely volunteer group including revealing our hosting provider. We are not a "non profit organization" - lemmynsfw is a volunteer instance being run on donations. People need to understand that this is no one's "job" and yet it's literally taking a ton of our time. I've spent so many hours pouring over lemmy code, system configurations, working with the mod tool group, brainstorming, writing code, and trying to help the real admins where I can...

And seriously, no one is being paid for this, donations barely cover server costs, and any excess donations are being saved because it's anticipated that server costs will continue to rise while donations don't. Besides, I don't think any of us WANT to be paid for fear of reprisal from our respective governments for "making money" off serving pornography.

When the creator put out his call for help, a bunch of us stepped up to try to keep the server alive, but this is not an easy instance to run. Please understand that.

I have absolutely no interest in the front side admin (content moderation, etc) but if we can find hosting in a country that won’t send me to prison for being a part of this, I can do most sysadmin of backend.

Whatever admin team develops from this feel free to dm me and we can discuss how that would work.