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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/15035901
The only surviving adult MOVE member, Ramona Africa, refused to testify in court and was charged and convicted on charges of riot and conspiracy; she served seven years in prison.
Jesus Christ! No criminal charges against police so let's imprison the sole surviving victim!
(She did get a handsome settlement years later, so there's that but holy hell man)
Qualified fucking immunity
Yet another thing to go after the revolution.
The police obtained arrest warrants in 1985 charging four MOVE occupants with crimes including parole violations, contempt of court, illegal possession of firearms, and making terroristic threats. Mayor Wilson Goode and police commissioner Gregore J. Sambor classified MOVE as a terrorist organization. Police evacuated residents of the area from the neighborhood prior to their action. Residents were told that they would be able to return to their homes after a 24-hour period.
There was an armed standoff with police, who threw tear gas canisters at the building. The MOVE members fired at them, and a gunfight with semi-automatic and automatic firearms ensued for 90 minutes... At 2 p.m., Sambor ordered that the compound be bombed.
From a Pennsylvania State Police helicopter, Philadelphia Police Department proceeded to drop two 1.5-pound bombs (which the police referred to as "entry devices") made of Tovex, a dynamite substitute, combined with two pounds of FBI-supplied C-4, targeting a fortified, bunker-like cubicle on the roof of the house. The bombs exploded after 45 seconds, igniting the fuel of a gasoline-powered generator and setting the house on fire, which was left to burn. Officials later stated that this was to let the fire burn through the roof and destroy the "bunker", so police could then drop tear gas into the house and flush out the occupants.
30 minutes later, firefighters moved in to control the fire but there was gunfire and the firefighters and police were ordered back as the fire spread to neighboring houses down the street.
The only two MOVE survivors, Birdie Africa, who was 13 at the time, and Ramona Africa, both escaped the house. Police initially said that two men had also run out of the house at the same time and fired at them and that police had returned fire. Ramona Africa said that police fired at those trying to escape. Police said that MOVE members moved in and out of the house shooting at the police. The fire department later declared the fire under control at 11:47 p.m.
Seems reasonable
Bombing a house in the middle of a residential area seems "reasonable"?
A judge and jury found the police department used unnecessary excessive violence and violated constitutional protections against unlawful searches.
That's definitely sarcastic.
We got some messed up people on this site already we can never be too sure.
Nah, police weren't adequately trained to handle something on this scale. Something had to be done, but not by police with satchel charges and an anti-tank machinegun.
I'm constantly told the 2nd amendment exists for the express purpose of shooting cops. Are you saying the 2nd amendment is in the wrong here and that police should have access to weapons denied to ordinary people?
If that’s all true, then that adult and child from the cult who lived are lucky they lived after their cult had the gall to shoot at firefighters.
EDIT: added words
You're assuming that both of them, including the 13-year old, fired at the firefighters?
No but I am assuming the two of them were a part of the larger MOVE group referred to as "they", especially given they both had the last name Africa which was adopted by all of the cult's members. It's a miracle anybody made it out of the compound after hours of gunfighting and fires that engulfed 2 blocks.
You should not assume children are part of any group or movement. This wasn't a good vs bad event, as reality seldom is. Shitty people on both ends resulted in a tragedy.
Uh okay pal, how about this reformatting:
If that's all true, then that adult and child from the cult who lived are lucky they lived after their cult had the gall to shoot at firefighters.
And racist think this kind of life destroying event generation after generations doesn't have a negative impact on a group of people. The fact that Black Americans have anything should be applauded. This is just one event, look up Oklahoma massacre, or our wide spread lynchings history. There are still to this day southern families that have body parts of black lynching victims because that's just what their ancestors did back in the day. Hunt down black people that didn't stay in line and mount a piece of their body over the mantel as a family heirloom.
TBF I think a cult compound in the middle of the city full of white people armed to the teeth who want to take down the government and keep missing their paroles wouldn't end well, either. This event was not in itself racism destroying generations, rather the result of.
Okay but did you know that they were brown people? Checkmate liberals
I remember this craziness. Was insane and of course, it was all considered ok.
I remember this craziness.
I remember that craziness because as a young adult, I was working nearby and saw the smoke clouds.
...and of course, it was all considered ok.
I'm unaware of anyone at all those days who considered it 'all okay.' On the contrary, it put a kind of national spotlight on Philly police' brutality going back to the Rizzo days, and doubtless contributed to Rizzo never being mayor again. And I think even amongst the folks who believed the bombing was justified, a large segment had to admit that it obviously went very, very wrong.
All that said-- yeah, as a nation I'm not sure we learned a damn thing out of all that. The police certainly didn't appear to.
Militarization of the police has been a wild fucking ride over the last 40 years.
Acorn drops and some pimple-faced teenager with a badge goes on a shooting rampage. Then we're told he needs better training, so we spend another couple million dollars bringing in IDF officers to train local cops on effective use of Skunk spray
Technically, they bombed a home. But it was a row home and they were too stupid to think about what happens when you set fire to a home connected to a bunch of others
and then they refused to let firefighters in
The ones that were being shot at?
Also Lemmy far-left people: It literally couldn't get any worse than Biden not decriminalizing weed as fast as I wanted him to. I don't see how letting Trump come to power would even make a difference.
Quite the strawman you built yourself there.
I actually do think it's a fake viewpoint -- I don't think a lot of people on the left actually think this; I think that most of the "far left" people on Lemmy who are saying it are propaganda trolls trying to depress the vote on the left in the upcoming election. But I've definitely had people say exactly this to me.
Maybe I should have made it clear that I'm not attacking actual "far left" people with my statement, yes; that's fair.
Ok that's messed