this post was submitted on 26 Jun 2024
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Enshittification

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What is enshittification?

The phenomenon of online platforms gradually degrading the quality of their services, often by promoting advertisements and sponsored content, in order to increase profits. (Cory Doctorow, 2022, extracted from Wikitionary) source

The lifecycle of Big Internet

We discuss how predatory big tech platforms live and die by luring people in and then decaying for profit.

Embrace, extend and extinguish

We also discuss how naturally open technologies like the Fediverse can be susceptible to corporate takeovers, rugpulls and subsequent enshittification.

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Rick Beato making clear what is happening on the music scene just as Cory Doctorow or Adam Conover talk about the Internet. Please remember to use frontends like Grayjay, NewPipe, Freetube or invidio.us to watch videos like these.

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[–] [email protected] 34 points 9 months ago (2 children)

I disagree with the sentiment that the music scene is getting worse, we are getting more content than ever but it's also much more discoverable, searchable and groupable.

I was just at an insane EDM festival the other day and all artists there were up and coming 25-30 y/o, people who are touring Europe doing gigs all over the place. They were selected because they are amazing DJ's with their own style, playlist and original songs.

Finding music, an artist or even an album you enjoy is just as hard as it used to be, but go into a local record shop, a local venue and ask them what bands you should check out, you'll see the same spirit people had 20-30 years ago going to gigs.

You know what I think Mr Beato? I think you are heavily out of touch with the modern music scene.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 9 months ago (1 children)

How much of the music at that EDM festival you went to will you listen to again? Will you buy any of their records? Or maybe just add a few of their tracks to a playlist on Spotify such that you may hear that music a couple more times in the future?

I may be making assumptions about you, but I think Rick's point about new music becoming "disposable" because there's just so much of it coming out remains valid. There's still new songs coming out that transcend this, but the musicians making this music are finding it harder and harder to build up a following, get exposure, and convince record labels to invest in them, when these labels can invest way less, produce a shitton of disposable music and get a better (short-term) ROI.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago

With the entire world having access to internet by now, isn't it only logical there's a massive increase in quantity of music being available? One figurative spotlight for a factor of thousands more possible successful artists. But at the same time the internet provides significantly more ways to discover and get people togheter.

"Harder" for the average artist is not how I would describe it, I think being a successful artist requires a different skillset then it used to. You have to be more tech/web literate or know someone who is to start. But it's still a grind, just like it used to be.

The internet does provide a way to instant fame. I've seen Youtube sets of people DJ'ing in their bedroom get noticed and overnight they are playing for hundreds of people. Yet again for the average artist it's a grind for years.

For context, I do collect vinyl so spend way to much on records, obviously not the average music listener. Sidenote: genres could be fluctuating in popularity, making it easier for some and harder for others.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 9 months ago

Yeah you know, I dunno about that Rick beato guy. I’m not sure about him. ^(beato)^

[–] [email protected] 22 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Please remember to use frontends like Grayjay, NewPipe, Freetube or invidio.us to watch videos like these.

Why not post a link to one of those platforms?

Kindof makes me think, there should be a canonical YouTube link that is not youtube.com, that could be use to refer to yt videos without the risk of accidentally clicking it and ending up in yt.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Paradoxically, I kinda prefer YouTube links because then I can configure my client to use whichever proxy/frontend I wanna use

[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Exactly! It is so much more user friendly to post the original and let individuals set their browser/device to open it wherever is preferred.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago

Oh absolutely!

My point is that it's easy for anyone to click the link and be taken to YouTube by accident.

But yeah. Given that YouTube is the source, I guess it makes sense to use the actual yt link.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago

That makes sense.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Becuase it is off-topic and I don't know exactly what platform readers are using

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Old-man-yelling-at-cloud energy.

[–] [email protected] 34 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

That's kinda how I feel about all of his videos. He's a great illustration of latching on to the music of your formative years and firmly stating that everything after that is crap.

In present day, you've got to sift through a lot of crap to find the good new stuff.

What this guy doesn't ever address is that has always been true.

My daughter always said I was lucky to grow up in the eighties because we had the best music. To this I responded that I only played her the good stuff. All the really crappy stuff, of which there was a LOT, kinda got filtered out of collective memory.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (2 children)

I’m into a few different genres of music - rock, metal, jazz, Afro Cuban, other shit that i can’t categorize (like all of john zorn’s shit). There’s so much good shit out there, so much modern and novel stuff, really musical and complex.

How’s this putz gonna tell me that Vijay Iyer or Tyshawn Sorey or Matthew Shipp are crap? Or the Reznor/Ross stuff? Or Nas’ tremendous burst of creativity over the past 6 years?

Edit: honorable mention to ghostface killah’s latest shit. The “guns” part of set the tone is dope af. 2nd half is weak, tho. Looking forward to supreme clientele 2. Wu Tang is forever.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago (1 children)

What this guy doesn’t ever address is that has always been true.

This is commonly known as Sturgeon's Law.

90% of everything is crap. There were a ton of bands contemporary to the Beatles. Most of them aren't well remembered.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago

I looked him up. He's an old session musician. Those guys get particularly bitter about modern studio production.

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[–] [email protected] 19 points 9 months ago (3 children)

Who else would rather spend 5 minutes reading than 12 minutes watching? Can I get a transcript?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)
[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I don't see that button on YouTube (Firefox android). Am I blind? Is it on some other front end?

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 9 months ago (4 children)

Almost all my favorite music was made before I was born. The rest was made mostly before the year 2000. And music has mostly been generic forgettable schlock since then. Rick’s analysis is spot on.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 9 months ago (3 children)

And music has mostly been generic forgettable schlock since then.

Mainstream* music.

Plenty of amazing artists out there who are not part of the music business machine.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 months ago (7 children)

Wait, you're saying your favorite music is from when you were young?! No way! That certainly has not always happened to the majority of people since time began!

/s

Snark aside, this is what happens to the majority of people as they get older.

Is there a lot of garbage out there these days? Absolutely. But this is in large part due to the fact that there simply is a lot more music coming out now than ever before because of how easy it's become for anyone to make and distribute their own songs. Yet is there also a lot of great music out there these days? Absolutely. And it's due to the exact same reason

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago

I'm with you on the fact that incredible music is still being made. It's not that hard to find, either. Bandcamp collates music on blogs for all types of taste, for instance. And there's all kinds of ways to play off what we already know we like to gradually discover new artists - and expand our tastes.

It's weird to me that people settle on a certain collection of music and then just stop. It's even odder when they then complain that nothing else is as good.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 9 months ago (3 children)

Old people hating new music. I've never ever heard that before. Definitely Spotifys fault.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 9 months ago

Beato is a great musician, and some of his interviews are pretty cool. I think he's off base on this, hwoever.

Enshittification is how platforms die. To go back to the original article/post by Cory Doctorow that coined the phrase:

Here is how platforms die: First, they are good to their users; then they abuse their users to make things better for their business customers; finally, they abuse those business customers to claw back all the value for themselves. Then, they die.

Beato isn't wrong that the music industry is well into the cycle of enshittification, he just doesn't identify the actual reasons why. The music industry abused its artists for decades in a way that initially benefitted music consumers, but then the studios/labels/publishers cranked up the prices on consumers too, and then the industry started devouring a lot of the publishers and studios and labels themselves as Spotify and Amazon and others started eating their lunch.

I do think there is a link between music industry enshittification and some negative trends in music. Cory Doctorow and his co-author Rebecca Giblin point out in their book Chokepoint Capitalism that platforms like Spotify prioritize mass production of cheap-to-license "background" music that all blends together in a mush, because they prioritize total volume of listening rather than any particular listening experience.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Rick often goes off on these angry-boomer tangents. I give them a miss.

[–] BodePlotHole 4 points 9 months ago

Yeah his "old man yells at cloud" arguments in this one are especially out of touch.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago

I thought this was going to be about the declining working conditions and prospects for musicians. Good music is still getting made, and the music industry is making more money than ever - it's just going to fewer and fewer people

[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago (2 children)

It's amazing to watch millennials become grandpa Simpson.

In my day music was actually good!

This is honestly pathetic, handle your mid life crisis's better

[–] [email protected] 21 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

Did you watch the video? Because that’s not really what he was saying. He was talking about how we consume music and how the studios and basically capitalism have “streamlined” and bastardized what is meant to be art. He’s talking almost exclusively about how capitalism has robbed us of human connection, how vampiric companies stopped paying to make things that cost more using human musicians in order to sterilize the music for broader appeal and to maximize profits.

Is that…something you disagree with? This is enshittification. Right here. This is a 100% match for the community you’re in. Don’t like that concept? Don’t interact with this community, basically.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago (1 children)

To the consumption part, I have given more money directly to more artists via discovering them on Spotify then attending their shows and buying their merch than I ever even came close to back in the record buying days when record companies were screwing their artists anyway.

I know quite a few bands personally who will never attain Taylor Swift levels of wealth, but they've got a business model of touring and merch down to a science that affords them a nice living doing what they love. This also includes tons of accessibility and fan interaction that very much didn't use to be a thing.

The savvy DIYers are sidestepping the entire record company schematic and using streaming services as effectively free marketing.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

If you think you are helping artists by listening to them on spotify, you might be wrong. Check out Cory Doctorow on Spotify

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Did you read my comment at all?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago

Haha seems I did not comprehend it. Thanks.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Same shit new day. Radio, tape decks, electronic generated music, Napster. They all are just spins on "music is shitty or dead and not worthwhile". It's been going on for ages.

There has always been shit, and there has always been indie and lesser known potentially more interesting music you have to look for.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago

Did you just call Baby Boomer Rick Beato a Millennial

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

I used to like Beatos videos. But honestly if anyone knows about enshittification it's him. He has done some killer interviews the past year, no one can that away from him. But my God his other stuff has just gone down a cliff. I think it was the debut of his website that made him greedy.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Compare his older videos to his more recent ones?

I stopped watching a little while after his website debut. I didn't make a list, sorry.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I ain't watching a bunch of videos of a topic that doesn't interest me just to notice a decline in content.

That's why I asked.

Two videos one good and one bad would be enough.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

I ain't watching a bunch of his videos when I decided a year ago it wasn't worth it, just to link them to you.

I don't care at all, past what I've already said.

If it doesn't interest you, and I have no interest in it, why TF would you think I should do anything?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Well, that would have been unreasonable of my part, bro.

Sorry, maybe I was unnecessarily rude.

Let's say I can pick his latest video as an example of bad stuff. Can you link a video you consider good?

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

I appreciate the honesty. Maybe tomorrow I'll check out some stuff. But really I think his good stuff recently has been his Nirvana interviews, Soundgarden interviews, and the interview with the STP guitarist who I feel bad about not remembering his name right now. If you can stand listening to Billy Corgan that's worth a listen too. Personally that's a tough one to sit through though.

Older stuff, again just off the top of my tired head, I liked the video he did about voice modulation. He's got a good one about how everything is recorded into perfect time signatures using software.

Edit. He was a producer. So a lot of the topics about the technical side of music is pretty good. He just tends to blow up his own head though, that's all.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago

Thanks! I'll check out the voice modulation video, then compare it to his recent stuff.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Please remember to use frontends like Grayjay, NewPipe, Freetube or invidio.us to watch videos like these.

No thanks. I will use my YouTube Premium account.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 9 months ago

There is a incredible amount of variety in modern music, you just have to look for yourself, and not just eat whatever is fed to you.

My only gripe with modern music, is that almost all live concerts seem to be single-artist now. I don't know if this is an effect of hiphop becoming the biggest genre, but I miss seeing an entire band on stage, not just a rapper and/or a DJ. They are definitely still there, but much less than even 10 years ago.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago

There is still great music and it is still a great time to consume music. But Beato is right that trap beats, quantized drums, and autotune all suck ass.

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