this post was submitted on 22 Jun 2024
1258 points (100.0% liked)
Political Memes
8159 readers
3336 users here now
Welcome to politcal memes!
These are our rules:
Be civil
Jokes are okay, but don’t intentionally harass or disturb any member of our community. Sexism, racism and bigotry are not allowed. Good faith argumentation only. No posts discouraging people to vote or shaming people for voting.
No misinformation
Don’t post any intentional misinformation. When asked by mods, provide sources for any claims you make.
Posts should be memes
Random pictures do not qualify as memes. Relevance to politics is required.
No bots, spam or self-promotion
Follow instance rules, ask for your bot to be allowed on this community.
No AI generated content.
Content posted must not be created by AI with the intent to mimic the style of existing images
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Let's run through the recent story so people have it:
(First on FDR, that was before 45 years of anti-communist rhetoric, which frankly turned into anti-government-policy rhetoric.)
Jimmy Carter: Told people to conserve and got voted the fuck out.
Bill Clinton: After successive losses Bill figured out "it's the economy stupid". And when you run against an incumbent (Bush senior) you have to run from the center. So that's what he did. And he won.
Gore: After the population hopefully warmed up with Bill Clinton, he stuck his head out left with climate change. And bam he lost the election. Thanks 3rd party protest voters!
Obama: So guess what Obama learned? Don't stick your head out. He ran on broad "hope", hoping the ambiguity would be enough considering Bush's disastrous wars. And he won.
Hillary Clinton: After the population hopefully warmed up with Obama, she stuck her head out just a tiny itty little bit left with the Map Room to fight climate change. And guess what happened? Bam she lost. Thanks protest non-voters!
Biden: Just like Obama learned from Gore, Biden learned from Hillary that you don't stick your head out left. And he was running against an incumbent, so once again when you do that you run center. He's actually been governing more from the left, but he ran center.
And people are amazed that they don't run an extreme left platform? Every time they stick their head out a little itsy bitsy tiny bit left they lose. And the next guy learns to go to the center to win.
So how do you get them to move left? By giving them victories. Consistent and overwhelming victories. Because when they lose, like they've lost 20 years out of the last 24 years, they will go to the centre to find votes. You don't get big steps without the small steps.
Revisionist history. To pretend like Hillary went slightly left and Gore didn't have the election stolen from him is disingenuous at best.
They claim Hillary lost because she went a little left and it is the fault of... left wing voters? Hmm.
I'm of the opinion that Hillary lost because of the blatant super delegate shenanigans within the DNC. I know I was LIVID. However, I wasn't one of the folks who were so livid that they protest voted third party. I held my nose, suppressed my gag reflex, and voted for Hillary, though I really didn't want to.
We're seeing it now with leftists who refuse to vote for Biden. Thankfully Lemmy isn't really representative of the population. But they do exist.
We are entering perhaps the most important election in history. I know that's said at every election but this time, this could very well be the last free election we have.
A vote against Biden, regardless of how it's done, is a vote for fascism. Plain and simple. It's no longer theoretical or fantasy. Or exaggeration or whatever the right is trying to paint this as.
Biden won in 2020 because it was a vote against Trump. Not because Biden was a good candidate. It just was not as terrible as Trump.
We are entering an election where Trump is promising to punish his enemies. This rhetoric is dangerous to our democracy and nation. The fact that we are debating this is by itself scary.
Trump WILL bring authoritarianism to our country. He will install himself as king and our country will be a democracy in name only. Hell it wouldn't surprise me if the fascist regime goes on to rename our country "The Democratic Republic of the ~~Gilliad~~ United States" just to keep up appearances.
Anyone who wants our country to be free must vote Biden in November. Is he contributing to genecide? Yes. Is he doing enough for climate change? Of course note. Is he tackling minimum wage? Nope.
But at least he's willing to listen to you. We might even be able to change his mind after he is in his second term.
You will get none of those things if Trump wins.
Honestly I think this is it. Do you think project 2025 goes away just because Trump does? It'll just be updated for 29 and as soon as the next Republican wins that's it, shows over. We can't keep pretending that winning this election will defeat them once and for all. It's just kicking the nuclear bomb down the road a bit. Eventually it will catch up and we will be living under a dictatorship anyways.
This is a terrible point of view.
No one is pretending this. We keep authoritarianism and fascism at bay through constant vigilance. We defeat them by resisting and rejecting them at every turn.
The idea that we should just give up is asinine.
I'm not saying to give up, I'm saying I want to see the Democrats do anything to protect us from a future Republican presidency other than hoping they'll be elected for the rest of time (which is an impossibility let's be real here)
No, the left wing non-voters, that didn't vote in protest.
That had nothing to do with that election or any election
There was actual fraud at play, stop blaming people fed up with this bullshit
Maybe you reply replied to the wrong message, because the left wing protest non-voters have to do with every single election.
Hillary lost because she coasted through the end of her run. Everybody thought Trump wouldn't stand a chance. We had more faith in people.
That and conservative psyops getting Bernie Bros to abstain from holding their nose and voting Hillary because they felt like they were being wronged.
Hey wait a sec that last part is happening again today...
Through the end? Most of her campaign was coasting by on solid blue areas and ignoring whole parts of the country.
So many people were surprised by her loss in 2016, but I saw it coming months away. The fact that her campaign pushed trump as a pied piper candidate and gave him credibility because they thought she could easily beat him is just the icing on the turd cake.
I said Hilary went an itsy bitsy teeny weeny bit left with the map room to fight climate change. That's what she did. And she lost. Thanks protest non voters!
Did we have President Gore? No we did not. We can talk all day about this or that, but we did not have President Gore. Thanks 3rd party protest voters!
Hillary lost because she was a corrupt, out of touch (Pokemon go to the polls), unlikable piece of shit who stole the primary from Bernie (as shown by the John Podesta email leaks). She also used the "pied piper" strategy to help Trump win the RNC primary because she thought he was the most beatable candidate. Voters didn't even know she wanted to fight climate change because she never talked about it. She also participated hardcore in voter shaming (which is also what you're doing) and ran a pro-corporate, right wing campaign against Trump in the general. No shit, she lost, especially in the Rust Belt, which Bernie was doing well in according to polls.
Al Gore lost because the Republican party refused to count several votes in Florida, claiming that hanging and dented chads were not valid. It was later found with a recount that Gore won that election.
When leftist voters have to choose between corporate right and corporate right, they will sit out, protest vote, or begrudgingly vote for the Democrat due to a lack of a better option. Voter shaming is extremely toxic and will actively repel leftist voters.
Voters need something to vote for, not against.
Whatever else you can say, Hillary was not channeling a lot of enthusiasm outside of a very narrow group.
It felt like there were weeks in peak campaign season where she wasn't touring or making speeches. What even was her signature issue? (Considering how she was associated with the abortive attempts towards universal health care during Bill's term, that would have been a sensible focus, but I don't recall it mentioned once)
The whole campaign reeked of "play to not lose" rather than "play to win". She assumed she was the annointed favourite, guaranteed the win, and that's not really going to excite uncommitted voters. Bernie, at least, generated buzz.
Hillary thought that the elites decide elections and not the voters, so she appealed to the elites more than the voters.
i see how it fits your theory but her leftness wasnt why people didn't vote for her. she didnt bother campaigning in the states that mattered and she acted entitled, and Bernie Sanders stole hearts while she stole DNC. etc etc.
She did do some campaigning early in those states. It turned out that the more they saw of her, the less they liked her. Her campaign kept her out of those states because she was a liability to her own campaign. Trump ran on fighting for average Americans. (Bullshit of course). Hillary ran on scolding the candidate offering change.
Holy shit trying to blame hillarys loss on being too progressive. Somehow more progressive than Obama.
I said itsy tiny little bit left with the map room. How many adjectives do you need? No one is saying she was far left, again see adjectives. That's what she ran on and bam she lost the election. Thanks protest no voters!
Have you considered why you have to use so many adjectives? Because she didnt at all run on a progressive platform. And you are claiming Obama won for not running on any progressiveness. He extensively ran on climate change and healthcare reform. Youve stretched your characterizations so far to try to fit your theory that you put Hillary to the left of Obama. Maybe its your theory that needs changing instead.
And you end up with the stupid idealist 3rd party voters that think “we’ll send a message with how we vote!” (Or don’t vote) not realizing the true impact they’re causing and the message it sends by having to go back to the center (which inches right more and more each time).
3rd party does have a place, but not right now with how screwed up things are.
Its forever going to be "not right now" for you, so we're not waiting anymore, its only going to happen if we make it right now.
No, no it’s not. And if Trump is elected again, it’s on anyone who things as much.
Its on people pushing a candidate they dont even like. Happened with hillary, its happening again with genocide joe. Let us support progressive candidates we like
Tell me you’re a Russian supporter, without telling me you’re a Russian supporter… that’s all I needed to know, thanks for playing.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/biden-administration-emergency-weapons-sale-israel/
Tell me you like painting others as strawmen without telling me you're painting people as strawmen.
Voter shaming will only make less people vote.
Many people need something to vote for, not against.
What happened with Hillary is that idiots decided to vote third party for a planted candidate and fucked everything up. Dividing progressive votes means a loss for progressives in every case. You will be part of the problem when Trump gets reelected and dismantles democracy. That will be the end of voting and the reemergence of mass suffrage. Oh and I forgot, climate change will continue to get worse and people will start getting sick because Trump has already promised to end climate/pollution regulations. Equal rights will be stripped and slavery will be brought back even for white people because, chances are, minimum wage will be wiped out. This dude plans to do so much damage if/when he gets back in office.
I agree, we should all vote for the progressive candidate.
And by "make it happen" you mean help get Trump elected and usher in a fascist dictatorship.
Maybe one day you'll entertain the notion that disregarding progressive voters and pushing a candidate you dont like could be to blame for trump winning, like in 2016.
Let's try the more recent history again.
Obama ran on "hope" but, more importantly ,"change" and won in a landslide. Then he governed from the center as a status quo technocrat. He lost a Democratic super majority and almost the presidency to a slice of white bread.
Hillary Clinton was the most establishment centrist candidate the Democrats could have possibly run. Her campaign thought they could sweep the country by choosing a radical clown for the Republican opponent. They helped the Trump campaign get free media attention to win the primary, then they lost to the clown.
After 4 years of the clown, the country would have elected a ham sandwich. Even so, it was looking a bit close, so Biden did what most Democrats do in a close election and leaned left, almost sounding like Bernie lite at times. You can chart his popularity through his presidency and every uptick coincides with a move to the left, and every downtick with a move to the right.
You also left out that Clinton only won because Perot was in the race and took voters from Bush, Carter lost because of the gas shortages, not to conserve and Biden won because he was against a historically unpopular incumbent. Your explanation is in complete and reductionist.
You also left out Kerry who ran as a moderate and lost to Bush.
Bill Clinton didn't run to the center, he ran to the right. Well past the center.
The "Hope" slogan was coined by Shepard Fairey on the poster of Obama he created and distributed independently of the Obama campaign, albeit with tacit approval. The campaign's actual slogans were "Change you can believe in" and "Yes we can."