Yeah and?
Israel invaded their country and is committing genocide. It should come to no one’s surprise that Israel fucks around and finds out during a war they started.
this post was submitted on 03 Oct 2024
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Israel killing civilians does not excuse Hama's killing civilians.
Israel bombs civilians : OMG!
Hamas bombs civilians: GOOD.
Jesus Lemmy
Yeah, how dare people treat a genocidal state and a people resisting genocide to different standards!!!1!
Genocidal state? Are we talking about America?
a war they started.
There are chances the outcome would be different if hamas released hostages, or didn't attack Israel on October 7th. Those things were not smart. It didn't serve any good purpose. A smarter thing would have been to prepare for such an attack from Israel by building defenses to protect civilians at the very least.
No there are not, this has been ongoing for decades and decades. Things would not have magically improved, it would have continued to be a slow death sentence whilst the world ignored it.
What Hamas did, no matter how tragic, has done more to bring light and international support to the plight of the Palestinian peoples and exposed Israel as the monster it is than anything else ever has.
That didn't worth it in my opinion. The level of international support is nowhere enough. And again, they could build defenses to decrease the number of victims.
Also the premise of "Israel is a monster" sentiment is hugely weakened by the monstrosity of the October attack itself.
Gaza is an open air prison. The ICJ concluded that it still was occupied since Israel retreated from it militarily as Israel still controlled all Land and Sea borders and destroyed the airport. Israel limited all sorts of goods going into Gaza well before October 7. They blocked construction material, telecommunications, limited medical and food supplies... The goal always was to slowly deteriorate the living conditions in Gaza so more people would leave, allowing Israel to occupy and annex again.
Hamas had and has very limited resources, which is why they fight in this way. And the world was quite happy to look away at Israel illegally occupying, annexing, killing civillians when it feels like in the Westbank and at demonstrations, running torture camps and taking tens of thousands of Palestinians hostage through "administrative detention" without any charge, without any due process, without even access to lawyers.
Gaza population was steadily increasing for all these years. This doesn't bode well with the "prison" sentiment in my opinion. They had institutions. They could teach their own population. Their actions could be more logical. Instead it seems they've been spreading terrorist propaganda (literally pushing their children to become merciless terrorists) and spending resources on building offensive tech instead of defenses. I can not justify actions of Israel (though I can understand why the ground operation was started) but there is no way I can agree that actions of hamas had any logical ground.
No it's not. More than one side can be monstrous in a conflict. "Yeah well but they did X so it's okay that we did Y" is bible level reasoning aka no reasoning and pretty much what is causing the whole thing anyway.
More than one side can be monstrous in a conflict.
I agree, which is why I don't support any monstrous regimes 🤷
You don't have to pick a side, it's a moral trap and being super loud about having an opinion doesn't stop the bloodshed or justify any of it.
The moral trap: Do I be anti-genocide or not?
I didn't mean to say anything that Israel did was okay. But a lot of it is understandable, e.g. the ground operation was very well expected by everyone when it became clear the hostages are not getting released. No matter how you look at it, Gaza was not ready.
And if we consider the October attack itself, only some of it is understandable ("they couldn't bear with oppression any longer" sentiment, which itself is problematic at best).
Just wondering, when do you think this war started?
This round of fighting started after the Hamas attack though.
The Ezzedine Al-Qassam Brigades takes responsibility for the heroic Jaffa operation carried out by the fighters from the [occupied West Bank] city of Hebron
Heroic operation? Shooting up a tram? Fuck off. This is not resistance, it's wanton murder. Random people in public transit are not legitimate targets.
The fanatic stupidity on display here is astounding. But what else to expect? Fanatic stupidity festers in occupation, dehumanization, and genocide.
This is probably the only way left for them to have any form of resistance. Since the international community have largely failed them and with Daddy Yankee and the war machine in Israel's corner there is no chance of conventional war even if they had the numbers.
These attacks create a culture of fear in everyday Israelis but if sustained it could possibly cause them to put pressure on their gov for a ceasefire and force Bibi out. Who knows, the whole situation is just tragic and has gone on for decades.
Maybe some day our species will realize the futility of war.
Meanwhile Israel bombed and killed 90 civilians on the same day, including an orphanage
The Apartheid needs to end for all this violence to end, none of these civilians deserve any of this.
There are no good guys in this conflict.
Oh no.... anyhow how about this weather?