I mean, if the reactors are already built and have plenty of life left in them…
this post was submitted on 16 May 2025
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Thats actually one of the problems.
Yes, there are 2 reactors in the country but they are so old, they needed replacement... In 2002.
Belgium doesnt have the money/wants to invest in a new reactor because that costs billions but really, really, really should...
Still, this is a step in the right direction
TBF work was done to keep it sound until 2025 and it was possible to extend the operational life further (basically you can just keep throwing hundreds of millions at them every 10 years for a long time to come).
What's fucked up is that in the last few years a bunch of maintenance wasn't done because the government said "no for real though super pinky promise we're not extending the contract again they will definitely be shut down in 2025 it's the law".
So now Electrabel/Engie is rightfully super pissed because this flip-flopping is going to cost us billions just to keep the existing reactors running. And they have zero guarantee the greens won't come back into a government coalition in 2029 and fuck the schedule up again.
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This stay, IMO, the big question mark. At which point does maintaining an aged machine is more expensive than building new one. Especially when 20 years are needed to build a new one (including 10 years of legal paperwork, trials and appeals)
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GOOD. BUILD MORE. The newer generations of nuclear plants can recycle their own waste and are basically meltdown proof. It's a no brainer. Shit is literally alchemy magic.
For the haters: https://youtu.be/5WKQsr9v2C0
Still (way) more expensive than just building cheap renewables.
Air and wind are inexpensive insofar as they have a low LCOE, but are intermittent, so require being coupled with energy storage, and that is not inexpensive.
If you're talking hydropower or geothermal, then they don't have the intermittency issue (well, hydro does, but to a far lesser degree), but both are subject to the geography of the area. They aren't available to everyone.
EDIT: And in the case of hydropower, there are also some environmentalists unhappy about the impact on river systems, since dams inevitably have at least some impact on river ecosystems, even if you build those fish channels.
EDIT2: "Fishway" or "fish ladder".
EDIT3: In fairness, for some uses, intermittency isn't such a big issue. That is, you may have an industrial process that you can only run when energy is available. So, for example, the Netherlands used to do this (sans electricity) with their windpumps in the process of poldering. That's not free
if you want your pumps to run only a third of the time on average, then you need triple the pumping capacity
but for some things like that, where the process is basically the pumping side of pumped hydrostorage, it might be cheaper than providing constant operation with a non-intermittent power source.
But for an awful lot of uses, people just want electricity to be available when they flip the switch.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra-high-voltage_electricity_transmission_in_China
Ideally we'd be doing/improving on something like this where modern nuclear plants can make up for gaps in renewables.
+120% cancer in children in the area...so worth it.
This is for the older plants. The newer plants are fundamentally different (Gen 3+). There are ways to mitigate these things.
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Nuclear shills out in full force again today, eh?
Lemmy seems 100% astroturfed by pro-nuclear lobbyists.
Fun fact: Multiple people with opinions different than yours are not automatically astroturfers or lobbyists. Turns out, different people have different opinions which they share on an open platform. Inevitably they're going to end up disagreeing with you.
Nuclear being less efficient and more expensive than renewables is not an opinion.
Renewables needing expensive storage isn’t an opinion either.
We all want a clean, efficient, and reliable power grid. Renewables should be a big part, and I’d prefer not having a bunch of hydrocarbons being burned whenever renewables don’t even cover the base load.
What do people mean by "less efficient" in these conversations? Energy generated is energy generated, the number one efficiency we should talk about is using less of it. Past that you're just choosing to optimize for cost, ecological impact, carbon footprint, etc...
So by that logic we should build energy sources that need the smallest input to get running. That's not nuclear, hence the "less efficient".
Again, efficiency is not the same thing as scalability. You're optimizing for investment cost (maybe build time? I can't tell). If we planned/regulated our usage better that's irrelevant because power usage is predictable.
People won't need more tomorrow than today unless they make a drastic change. If electricity isn't cheap and elastic by default, they just won't buy that high watt GPU or electric car. Bitcoin isn't such an important social good that it needs instant access to a continent's worth of power, but it gobbled it up because nobody stopped it.
And even if you do need account for something unpredictable, you can still adjust with other sources. That doesn't mean they need to be the foundation of your whole grid.
Ah yes lobbyists and not just people with basic common sense, sure
Ah yes "common sense", the go to argument from everyone ranging from people who want to throw out migrants to nuclear shills.
After all, why wouldn’t we burn billions on a technology that is less efficient per kw/h, takes decades longer to build, doesn’t scale, has a worse LCOE than renewables and leaves us with toxic forever waste? It’s just common sense bro.
"After all, why wouldn’t we burn billions on a technology that requires destructive mining and large scale plastic waste production for a worse climate footprint? What a solar shill"
See, I too can make emotionally charged statements with no basis in reality. All energy solutions have more nuance than "radiation bad" or "cheap good"
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leaves us with toxic forever waste?
Not enough to be relevant
doesn’t scale,
Scale is just how much you build
less efficient per kw/h,
Continuous power generation.
takes decades longer to build
We could build it faster if we were willing
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Article is wrong on a major point though:
They are not undoing the phase-out part (actually a cap on the active lifetime of a reactor), but lifting the ban on building any new reactors. There is no deal to maintain the currently active plants any longer than what the previous governments negotiated with Electrabel/Engie over and they are still poised to close qs planned
This change is here because the ban included medical/research reactors, such as the one in Mol that used to provide chemo-therapy products, which we are now buying abroad.
As for the other arguments usually found on this topic:
- Belgium lacks the space for a scaling-up of windmills, and with the control-components found in chinese transformers, (who have a 80% market share in solar) it would give the Chinese government the power to literally damage our infrastructure, or cause shutdowns like Spain & Portugal saw. All without leaving evidence behind, btw. So an energy reliance built on Chinese products is as dangerous as building it around a Russian gas pipeline.
- Nuclear power has a lower CO2 footprint per GW, lower injury & death toll, and isn't even the top radiation pollution source. (That's actually coal, with Wind a potential second if we had more data on Bayan Obo)
- While >90% of solar panels currently in use globally have no pre-determined disposal, Belgium does require a contribution to Recubel on sale, so their waste which can contain stuff like PFAS atleast won't end up in a landfill. There is no national recycling plan for windmills as far as I could find.
- The largest cost of nuclear power is safety. Both reactor & waste. The largest gain is a massive amount of reliable electricity. Unfortunately, due to how global energy markets work, the profit has become unreliable (ironically in part due to solar/wind) and large nuclear plants are generally considered an economic loss. That's why Engie doesn't want to keep the nuclear plants open anymore, they make more money from "emergency capacity" subsidies not running gas power plants than actually producing electricity in Doel & Tihange. But if someone figures out a way, why would you stop them from innovating? Not to mention the law also banned any potential 'safe' methodin the future, like Thorium reactors, fission, ...
- It's still legal to build a coal plant in Belgium, the government only regulates safety & waste when you do. This law repeal puts nuclear power at the same level as all other sources. It is up to the experts at FANC to define what a safe nuclear plant is, and to investors if the think it's worth the cost, be it financial, PR, or other.
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Cracks in the pressure vessel? Nah, this'll hold another two decades...
What they ought to be doing is investing in thorium reactor development.
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