As long as:
Stolen land is given back, and criminals prosecuted,
Sure.
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As long as:
Stolen land is given back, and criminals prosecuted,
Sure.
You want to prosecute criminals responsible for an insane amount of death? Believe it or not, anti-Semitic.
You want justice for people whose lives have been systematically destroyed over 70+ years? Believe it or not, anti-Semitic.
This person actually believes they're being brilliant suggesting a one state solution but is that really for the benefit of the Palestinian people? Or is it to further push save Israel agenda since everyone can now see their true nature.
So I, a jew who has never even been to Israel, who's ancestors left centuries ago, am responsible for the state of Israel in any fucking way?
Jewish does not mean Israeli... At all.
Ummm I never said that.
I agree that Jewish does not mean Israeli.
I'm specifically talking about individuals involved in war crimes that they should be held accountable.
Anti semitic remarks are not the same as anti Israeli remarks
I feel nothing when that guy changed "death, death to the IDF". Well, maybe a mix of amusement and concern. But I have nothing, at all, to do with the IDF and do not support what they do
When you say, in this context, "I'll cool it with the anti semitic comments when war criminals are brought to justice", how do you think that feels?
Don't take this shit casually, anti semitism goes back to biblical times. I've experienced it growing up. And now, they're asking new York Jews what they think of "their" prime minister? They're "othering" us already
They just built a concentration camp. In America. The Holocaust wasn't the first time they targeted the Jews as the enemy within. I've always reminded my family who start flirting with conservatism... We're always second. When they run out of people that look different, we're next
I know what you meant. But that's not what you said, and words matter
So I, as a jew, who has never even been to Israel, don't feel threatened by the original comment at all, because I'm not an Israeli settler and haven't kicked anyone off their property, and thus don't have to fear having to give anyone their stolen property back.
Jewish people and groups around the world need to issue strong rejection of Israel's actions.
If they don't, i'm very concerned that Israel's crimes will fall back on them in the future.
Israel is the most anti-Jewish state since Nazi Germany, and Palestinians are semitic.
Unfortunately, the term "antisemitic" no longer has any kind of fixed meaning. I wish that weren't true, and I think it's a combination of forces that decided to misuse the word for several decades, that have now led to it being meaningless.
And you might be tempted to tell me what you think it means, and maybe I could agree with you, but when I turn on the TV tomorrow someone else will be using it in a totally different way that's inconsistent. Actually I'm kidding. I don't have a TV.
Words that people misuse are still meaningful when the reader and writer both understand the same meaning. I expect you understand OP perfectly well.
I have never, ever heard of someone calling for the deportation of Israelis. I think anyone who wants that was probably anti-semitic already and has taken the objectively horrific actions of the IDF as a reason to hate Jewish people in general.
I have never, ever heard of someone calling for the deportation of Israelis.
Calling for their in-place deaths is not a lot better. You have heard that one several times, right?
So many people on the left for whom jew = Zionist = fascist Israeli. It plays right in the hand of all the actual right-wingers and fascists supporting Israel. Appalling and stupid.
Where are these phantom lefties that think of Jewish = Zionist. Stop making shit up.
Most reasonable people out there know that being Jewish =\ zionists. There are plenty of Jewish people out there that are against Israel. It's the Israeli government that has tried their best to conflate the two in order to protect their own murderous regime.
Where are these phantom lefties that think of Jewish = Zionist. Stop making shit up.
You might be having in-group bias if you cannot see this happening.
Isn't that the stance of Israel as well? They claim to be the representatives of all jewish people.
I really don't understand people who think a one state solution is possible anymore. I'm not sure if it ever was but certainly at this point it's not viable.
Nothing is "viable" if you just extrapolate the present, except I guess genocide.
To take a step back, moral ambition and political courage are necessary. If Ireland could reach a Good Friday Agreement, if South Africa could overcome apartheid, so can Palestine/Israel.
A plurinational democratic state with equal rights for all, with a truth and reconciliation process, and with strong international support is the only way the middle east can ever reach peace.
And if we are putting on big boy pants and imagining a better world, why not envision the Mediterranean Union becoming a force for democratization and stabilization allowing the free movement of people throughout the region.
When realism is dystopian, fuck realism and pick utopia. Otherwise, why even live?
Israel is already a one state solution, it contols all the territory from the river to the sea, and commiting apartheid and genocide.
End apartheid and you have a single state where everyone is free.
One apartheid state is no viable.
I mean, the situation is so fucked that saying anything is 'viable' at this point is a pipe dream. But I mentioned a one-state solution to emphasize that I'm not asking anyone to be pro-Israel, or even ask that Israel, as a state, should be allowed to continue to exist. My opposition is to advocacy for genocide and ethnic cleansing.
Fuck Israel, genocidal scum!
I mean sure. Don't me a racist bigot. Of course.
But let's not pretend that religion isn't fueling the atrocities being committed on both sides of the conflict.
Jews, Muslims, and Christians lived in that area together for hundreds of years. This is a political conflict. The fucking Israeli settlers are psychopaths who roll into towns and start setting things on fire. It’s about territory, like all colonialist aggression.
Just gonna leave this here…
This map is extremely misleading. The green areas shows very different things in each map.
Religion does have a nonzero influence, but you're correct in that this is primarily a political conflict. Zionists murder Muslim and Christian Palestinians alike, and Fatah, a secular resistance movement, was the leading org of the Palestinian side for the longest time.
Religion isn't fueling it, it is just used as moral justification from both sides. If religion didn't exist the same thing would happen, but with a different form of moral justification.
While it is a lunatic statement, it isn't antisemitic. It's only antisemitic if it applies to jewish Palestinians that have a connection to the land. The jewish Israelis of European descent aren't connected to the land. Thus, this isn't antisemitic. But I do agree that it is a lunatic statement anyway.
EDIT: What I'm trying to say is that this is a nationalist stance not an antisemitic one. Those expecting all Israelis to leave like that aren't doing so because they're jews but because they're settlers. This is however, if you lack the reading comprehension, a position I haven't even claimed to support, but on the contrary, I even condemned it. What I am doing here is pointing out that not everything that relates to Israel has to boil down to antisemitism. That's a braindead position
While it is a lunatic statement, it isn’t antisemitic. It’s only antisemitic if it applies to jewish Palestinians that have a connection to the land. The jewish Israelis of European descent aren’t connected to the land. Thus, this isn’t antisemitic. But I do agree that it is a lunatic statement anyway.
Oh my fucking God, when did leftism become Blut und Boden nationalism?
Should nazis have been integrated into post-ww2 solution?
Zionism is similarly a genocidal fascist ideology. If these colonizers can't handle freedom, democracy, equality, etc., then they should definitely return to their actual homes. That's extremely generous. I don't know what else you would expect.
Libs running cover for zios is just another example of how liberalism supports fascism. And this actively contributes to anti-semitism.
Oh we out here making friends in these comment sections today.
This thread is going so "it's bad to call for the genocide of israel" i had to re-read the meme.
It says "expell israelis to europe"... it doesn't say "kill'em all", wtf is wrong with this thread? Or am i missing something?
And no, a one state solution is not possible, as shown after over 70 years. Unless that state was to be ruled and controlled by the UN and all other military forces completely dismantled - so, not gonna happen.
It would be slightly less unrealistic if the UN was to enforce the Green Line, ensuring the West Bank and Gaza are entirely in control of Palestinians.
Both fail 'cos the UN has no teeth.
Full embargo on israel, especially on weapons, could work, but, again, hypocrites of this world won't let it happen.
But do the Israelis WANT to integrate though ?
No. But neither did the American South.
At some point, reality forces the issue.
With climate change picking up the pace in the last few years, not sure how much longer this area will even be inhabitable.