this post was submitted on 27 Sep 2024
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[–] KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com 210 points 6 months ago (7 children)

fun fact.

The US army gave people ammunition for free if it was used to kill bison for a period of time.

Bison almost went extinct.

Bison were a source of food for the natives.

I love american history!

[–] craftyindividual@lemm.ee 66 points 6 months ago (6 children)

Every 50 bison they killed they celebrated a bisontennial.

[–] jaybone@lemmy.world 16 points 6 months ago
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[–] Maggoty@lemmy.world 29 points 6 months ago (8 children)

The official reason was the Bison herds were capable of destroying the fields of entire farms. We never stopped to ask if we should have been farming there in the first place.

[–] cRazi_man@lemm.ee 17 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I think they did stop to ask, and the answer they gave themselves was "yes".

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[–] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 71 points 6 months ago (1 children)

It’s just greed. They throw in god’s name to relieve themselves of any personal responsibility.

[–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 34 points 6 months ago

They also throw in God's name to get the religious rubes on board.

[–] Nuke_the_whales@lemmy.world 67 points 6 months ago (5 children)

Ok. Native here. Get out, both of you.

[–] harmsy@lemmy.world 34 points 6 months ago (1 children)

If I thought some other place would take me, I would.

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[–] Maggoty@lemmy.world 19 points 6 months ago (4 children)

Go back to Ireland/Scotland? Sure. I need to bring news of what fun things Americans can do with potatoes back to the homeland anyways.

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[–] evroid@lemmy.world 54 points 6 months ago (3 children)
[–] masquenox@lemmy.world 25 points 6 months ago (2 children)

It's kind of disingenuous.

It portrays Orthodox Jewishness as being responsible for genocidal Zionism when Orthodox Jewishness has pretty much always been vehemently critical of both Zionism and the creation of Israel.

The Jewish Zionists that perpetrated the Nakba looked no different than their fellow Europeans.

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[–] eldavi@lemmy.ml 13 points 6 months ago (1 children)
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[–] masquenox@lemmy.world 48 points 6 months ago (3 children)

I think at this stage we can just call manifest destiny "Americanism."

[–] Iapar@feddit.org 18 points 6 months ago (4 children)

I am kind of annoyed by the ismnisms lately.

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[–] kSPvhmTOlwvMd7Y7E@lemmy.world 33 points 6 months ago (15 children)

Well, except Europeans never lived in America before Columbus, but Jews did live in Palestine/ Middle East

[–] CarbonIceDragon@pawb.social 67 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Which hardly matters when people are taking the homes of people living there currently and killing them. What difference does it make if some of someone's ancestors centuries ago lived in that general part of the world?

You could justify European colonialism in Africa under similar logic, on the grounds that since humans evolved there before spreading out to the rest of the world, all Europeans have ancestors that lived on that continent at some point in the past and would merely be "reclaiming" it.

[–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 56 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (1 children)

Some did, but the whole point of Israel was a place for European countries to send their Jewish populations.

People who even if they were also ethnically Semitic, were descended from people who voluntarily left the area generations ago.

They could have immigrated there, instead European governments just declared it was theirs now.

Like, imagine if every American with Irish heritage were granted birthright citizenship there and the people who never left are shoved down into an ever shrinking slice of land. That's what's happening

[–] woop_woop@lemmy.world 10 points 6 months ago (1 children)

were descended from people who voluntarily left the area generations ago

There have been forced deportations from that area for millenia. They're talked about in the Bible and the Romans did it.

[–] eacapesamsara@sh.itjust.works 18 points 6 months ago (3 children)

Weird then how the majority of Palestinians are a genetically unbroken set of lineages from before the kingdoms of Israel and Judah. Some deportations from very specific areas happened, like from Jerusalem to the West Bank during Roman rule.

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[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 30 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Jews did live in Palestine/ Middle East

Look up the history of the Beta Israelis / Ethiopian Jews and their treatment in the reconstituted state of Israel.

Compare that to the treatment of Afrikaner Israeli converts emigrating from South Africa and Russian/Ukrainian Jews fleeing violence in the current Russo-Ukraine War.

You'll notice one of the groups was targeted for mandatory sterilization and it wasn't the white folks.

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[–] queermunist@lemmy.ml 22 points 6 months ago (32 children)

The Jewish settlers didn't live in Palestine, they lived in Europe and then moved to Palestine to steal the land. They're white.

Just because one ancestor a dozen generations ago lived somewhere doesn't mean you have a right to evict the actual people living on that land.

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[–] chonglibloodsport@lemmy.world 33 points 6 months ago (3 children)

The situation isn’t comparable. The majority of Jews in Israel are not European (or from anywhere else), they’re native Israeli and they trace their roots to Israel back for millennia.

The problem is not that Israelis want to live there. They have a right to live there. The problem is that they’re depriving Palestinians of their right to live there instead of seeking peaceful coexistence.

[–] finitebanjo@lemmy.world 48 points 6 months ago (12 children)

Pretty sure modern Israel was founded by western powers as a place to send Jews after WWII.

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[–] doggle@lemmy.dbzer0.com 27 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I've met a guy who no shit said this to me as if it was a justification for Israel's actions in Gaza.

[–] IndustryStandard@lemmy.world 18 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Anyone mentioning the phrase "3000" years ago is saying it. The Zionist movement is less than 150 years old. The rest of that history is made up.

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[–] TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world 22 points 6 months ago (1 children)

The notion of a "promised land" is a lie humans tell to themselves to monopolise the resources we all share with all living things.

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[–] JoYo@lemmy.ml 20 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Palestinians aren't natives. they migrated at the same time as everyone else, 1 million people in 10 years.

[–] Idreamofcheesy@lemmy.world 35 points 6 months ago (12 children)

Yep, it was the only habitable parcel of land in the world with zero inhabitants until 1832. Jewish people and Palestinians both saw this weird chunk of land and realized they could just move there since no one else was there.

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[–] aubeynarf 18 points 6 months ago (7 children)

Linkerbaan, where are you yourself from?

[–] philo@lemmy.ca 25 points 6 months ago (4 children)

He's a Trump fanboy from the US who gets his kicks masquerading as a far-left liberal.

[–] LesserAbe@lemmy.world 19 points 6 months ago (16 children)
[–] philo@lemmy.ca 12 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Check out his post history. Quite a few people know and keep banning him from different communities but he keeps popping back just like his orange hero.

[–] Linkerbaan@lemmy.world 23 points 6 months ago (11 children)

Your post history is supporting israel. Are you sure you don't want Trump to win?

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[–] Psychodelic@lemmy.world 12 points 6 months ago

The OP? What's that based on? All their posts are just critical of Israel

That said, given how lemmy works, there's no real recourse anyway. This is a good, funny post, so I'll upvote it. Since upvote points aren't tracked there's nothing we can really do to tell bad actors apart from people that actually contribute to communities/discussions. If it mattered, I'd maybe downvote but it doesn't since every post they make ends up being treated individually by the community (unless you track usernames or something and I personally don't pay for that feature)

You'd have to comment on all their posts if you wanted it to stick, and then if it's not obvious like here, you'd have to provide reasoning each time. I don't get it but most people really didn't like points being added up for some reason

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