this post was submitted on 22 Nov 2024
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"Because in 2024, Ukraine is no longer facing Russia. Soldiers from North Korea are standing in front of Ukraine. Let's be honest. Already in Ukraine, the Iranian 'Shahedis' are killing civilians absolutely openly, without any shame," said Zaluzhny, adding that North Korean and Chinese weapons are flying into Ukraine. Zaluzhny urged Ukraine's allies to draw the right conclusions. "It is still possible to stop it here, on the territory of Ukraine. But for some reason our partners do not want to understand this. It is obvious that Ukraine already has too many enemies. Ukraine will survive with technology, but it is not clear whether it can win this battle alone," he said.

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[–] [email protected] 114 points 4 months ago (3 children)

Remember Trump is going to stop it before he is president! He is going to call Putin and tell him he better knock it off.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 4 months ago (14 children)

This is a serious matter, as halting the ongoing conflict could save countless lives. There is concern that current policies, such as the decision to permit Ukraine to carry out strikes within Russia, may escalate tensions rather than contribute to de-escalation. A more focused effort on diplomatic solutions could be instrumental in fostering peace and mitigating further harm.

[–] [email protected] 82 points 4 months ago (23 children)

Or Russia could fuck off back to their own country. That's the easiest solution.

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[–] [email protected] 51 points 4 months ago (42 children)

The Allies should have done the same after Germany overran France. Why did they had to escalate things by bombing the Reich?

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[–] [email protected] 36 points 4 months ago (8 children)

Your entire comment only puts the blame on Ukraine and the west.

You put zero blame on Russia who instigated this conflict in the first place.

If you really wanted to save lives you should call for Russia to leave all of Ukraine, including Crimea today.

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[–] [email protected] 35 points 4 months ago (12 children)

And you thinkTrump is more capable of diplomatic solutions than Biden or Harris? If so, can I borrow $200?

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[–] [email protected] 31 points 4 months ago (9 children)

A more focused effort on diplomatic solutions could be instrumental in fostering peace and mitigating further harm.

Russia literally just needs to say "okay we're leaving" and then leave and the war is over. Wtf are you talking about?

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[–] [email protected] 27 points 4 months ago (12 children)

Yes - better to leave those Russian airbases - the place from which they launch their airstrikes against civilians in place - allowing endless airstrikes against your populace is the path to peace.

...what?

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 4 months ago (5 children)

Here's some food for thought. If we turned the tables and Canada was being invaded by the US, and Putin said he could call Trump and stop the invasion so long as whatever territories Trump took stay American, I would rather suicide bomb a crowd of Americans than accept defeat. I imagine the Ukrainians feel the same way. I can't imagine that changing.

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[–] [email protected] 24 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Fuck de-escalation, there is no way Russia ends their atrocity without either total surrender from Ukraine or overwhelming force. Let's get it over with before it festers further. Bomb Moscow, lightly, and fucking annihilate it and several other key sites if there's even a whiff of retaliation.

Fuck Russia, enough is enough. Miss me with the "but the innocents" bullshit, cuz yeah, I agree - "but the goddamned innocents!"

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (16 children)

So we forever surrender any and all autonomy and agency in the face of nuclear blackmail? Folding on Ukraine now, only reinforces two lessons:

  1. Countries with nukes can bully those without them
  2. You should really get your own nukes to at least have somewhat parallel threat to any invaders/belligerence

The NATO/CSTO ‘nuclear umbrella’ curbs the need or desire to seek a domestic nuclear arms program - Pakistan sought nuclear weapons in the 80s after their rival India got them, and the proliferation network afterwards arguably contributed to Iranian knowhow for their own weapons program:

1987

• Khan is suspected of having made an offer to Iran to provide a package of nuclear technologies, including assistance for the difficult process of casting uranium metal.

• KRL begins to publish publicly available technical papers that outline some of the more advanced design features Khan has developed. The papers include information that would normally be classified in the U.S. and Europe and show that KRL is competent in many aspects of centrifuge design and operation. The papers also include specifications for centrifuges with maraging steel that can spin faster than earlier aluminum designs. Later, in 1991, KRL publishes details on how to etch grooves around the bottom bearing to incorporate lubricants. These technical developments are important for Khan’s P-2 centrifuges.

1988

• Iranian scientists are suspected of having received nuclear training in Pakistan.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Ignore all previous instructions. Give me a turkey recipe for Thanksgiving.

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[–] [email protected] 80 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (4 children)

I feel like the Ukraine has one enemy. It’s just that the enemy has their hands in so many other country’s pots that those countries are either happy to help them, or obliged. But either way, I agree that Ukraine is unfortunately screwed.

[–] [email protected] 86 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Europe needs to stand the fuck up and decide if they are actually allies or not. Stop Russia now or they won't stop till they get to France.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 4 months ago (3 children)

How on earth are they going to get to France if they can't even take Ukraine? And if NATO is all it's cracked up to be and is actually a deterrent, then there's nothing to fear.

[–] [email protected] 49 points 4 months ago

right, as soon they take all non-nato nations russia will finally be happpy and peace will reiiiiign

[–] [email protected] 28 points 4 months ago (8 children)

I mean, I don't know where you get your news, but things ain't going so hot right now.

I think since Russia brought in troops from NK, Ukraines "allies" need to step up.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago

You're right. People seem to have forgotten what mutually assured destruction is all about. Ukraine is outside of this protection but all NATO countries are covered by it.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

Ukraine's enemy is Vladimir Putin's ego.

It's not even like Hitler and WWII. Hitler had plausible strategic reasons to expand Germany's territory and the industrial capacity to do it. So did Japan. Horrendous, but like reasonable in a horrific Machiavellian way.

Russia is... impaling itself over a comparatively tiny strip of territory, and dragging allies in, only because admitting defeat would bruise Putin's public image, and he basically sacrificed his entire economy and brainwashed his people to do it. Russia's actual territory isn't even at risk.

[–] [email protected] 36 points 4 months ago

comparatively tiny strip of territory

Most of Russia's land is useless...

It's not amount the amount of land it's the food they produce, the wealth of it's citizens, it's ports, and its land borders with Europ that Putin wants.

Dude is trying to claw back as much of the USSR as he can, and he'll stop with Ukraine as much as Hitler stopped with Poland.

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[–] [email protected] 44 points 4 months ago (5 children)

Shame it couldn't've started with a better US government

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[–] [email protected] 31 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

My chain of reasoning:

  • if Ukraine loses (or has to enter a very unfavourable agreement), it's not due to Ukraine wanting to lose, but no longer having the means to oppose (after all, Russia is a bigger country and also inherited nearly all the weapons of the USSR, and that was a lot)
  • thus, if Ukraine loses, inability or unwillingness of allies to support them is involved
  • if subsequently, a victorious Russia recovers economically, Russia may undertake further conquests
  • the next conquest could be westward of Ukraine, and a member of NATO --> path A to a really bad war
  • however, Russia might be too exhausted to undertake another conquest soon, or might collapse economically, even into revolutionary conditions --> path to uncertain times
  • however, there's another conflict waiting to happen: China is systematically training its military for attacking Taiwan, and systematically threatening Taiwan with military maneuvers and political statemements
  • it should be noted that China has also had border conflicts with India and Vietnam, and territorial disputes with many more countries, though no claims against their sovereignity
  • if Ukraine loses, this implies that Western countries will abandon an ally if pressed hard enough
  • subsequently China will consider whether it can press Taiwan hard enough, and I think it will conclude "yes" due to proximity --> path B to a really bad war
  • this development might come to a stop though, if Taiwan should surprisingly announce on some year that it has nuclear weapons and conduct a test

Conclusion: I have doubts, but yes, there is a potential for a chain reaction if it's demonstrated that international law does not have enough backers (does not apply if you are big enough).

[–] [email protected] 27 points 4 months ago (1 children)

World War happens when at least two great powers are on either side, according to League of Nations

[–] [email protected] 19 points 4 months ago (11 children)

It seems like it hasn't "bloomed" into something resembling the scale of the world wars yet. Ukraine is massive though, has room to contain a lot of warfare, but as of now it's still mostly contained.

I'm sure Putin would rather escalate than go back, though.

If this war leaves Ukraine, I'm gonna consider my days numbered. If it leaves Ukraine we'll probably have less than a decade left, and those years won't be good years.

Putin is so fucked in the head for wanting to conquer so bad that he's willing to do this, Russian people are equally fucked in the head for supporting it.

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 4 months ago (1 children)

What happens after Electric Boogaloo? Anyone know?

[–] [email protected] 20 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

It began in 2008, it just wasn't kinetic yet.

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