It’s time to part ways with the toxic US.
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Excellent article.
Main points for me:
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Horizon Europe, digital sovereignty and technology, GDPR. YES! And absolutely we should be strengthening our privacy laws. We should be moving towards GDPR and we should be pushing for right to repair, etc.
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Green Alliance, climate collaboration, and collaboration on the Arctic. YES! But see the impacts of CETA/ISDS/ICS too.
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Freedom of movement. Yes, but: Europe's model of immigration has the opposite values than ours. We shouldn't let European phobic attitudes to immigration hamstring us from developing further ties, e.g., with the north african and sub-saharan francophonie. But we should definitely, absolutely further develop Erasmus+ and other EU-Canada youth exchange programs. And it should become extremely fluid and frictionless to recognize European professional credentials in Canada. An Italian doctor or a Greek nurse or a Spanish engineer or a German tradesperson should be able to start practicing in Canada within weeks at worst. EDIT: Also, linked with deepening research collaboration: Canadian temporary permits (study, work) should start to be recognized as means to expedite or eliminate EU visitor visas. We welcome fantastic international students who come from places Europeans over-scrutinize (the Maghreb, Africa, Iran, India, ...) and are in a disadvantage for research collaborations and/or research visits in the EU.
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But I would be squarely against closer political and monetary integration with the EU. We absolutely do not need the Euro or the Stability and Growth Pact, and we do not need the various Orbans, LePens and Melonis, or the various debt-phobic Germans and Dutch having any kind of veto over our policies or say over our politics. The Norwegian, Swiss and Icelandic models are good models of EU-collaboration, and we can of course develop our own. We can be very very very good friends, but just like we don’t need to be anyone’s 51st state, we also don’t need to be anyone’s 28th member state.
Finally: for that matter, we should be looking for similar degrees of integration with Japan-Korea-Australia, etc. We are uniquely positioned to unite Pacific and Atlantic. To quote Carney: "if US no longer wants to lead, Canada will".
We’re done with the US but we’re also not joining the EU, although we have great allies there.
You mean you are done with the US and you are not joining the EU and not all Canadians feel this way.
A national survey conducted by Abacus Data in late February 2025, involving 1,500 Canadian adults, revealed:
- 44% believe the Canadian government should “definitely or probably” explore joining the EU.
- 34% are opposed to the idea.
- 23% remain undecided.
high level figures in the EU have repeatedly stated that while they appreciate the gesture, Canada wont ever be a member. So its best to abandon those pipe dreams. When it comes down to the details, the EU is a boys club for Western and Central Europe, they dont even treat their Eastern members as anything more than a buffer zone against the Russians,
the EU isnt flawless either, Russia has infiltrated it with trojan horse governments like the Hungarian Fidesz party and the Slovakian SMER party, who embezzle EU funds and politically roadblock motions with their veto. Canada trying to decouple with the US just to dive into the EU is like running from a burning house into a house with a basement meth lab.
let me give you a counter argument as a german citizen:
The EU is still a union of a multitude of countries, all pretty different in their approach on geopolitics, economy and security. But we are a union that has brought peace for the longest time Europe ever had uninterupted. We aren't totally homogenous when it comes to values, but we align each other pretty well. Hungary, Slovakia, at times Poland (although since 2020 their rhetoric has been largely overlooked) are doing their best blocking progress, but they aren't really in a position to do so for much longer. Among european unionists and federalists there has also been talk about a multi-level EU model, where you don't have to 100% commit to EU regulations and laws, and still enjoy the benefit of the european singlemarket, possibly Schengen-Access, or at least visa free.
So, never say never ;)
as others in this same thread have said.
Canada even in its crisis mode facing the prospect of a hostile America, with its whole Canada First, Elbows up rhetoric, is still -extremely- "americanized". Our ideas of Liberalism and Conservatism are very right wing compared to Europe, much like how the US republicans and democrats are both right wing compared to say, a German or French parliament.
it would take a very long time and a lot of pain and suffering in Canada to move away from the status quo. The NDP are the closest thing to a left wing party in this country and politically, they're on track to be absolutely eviscerated and effectively dismantled as a party in our election.
I "grew up" with people online since I was a teenager, I've visited Europe, I had close friends fromthe UK, Germany Poland and France, I've had relationships with people from Ukraine and a Portuguese born UK, I understand the European values and customs... the thing is, people like me are a minority even in Canada. Canadians have grown accustomed to a hybrid system thats kind of like Europe and Kind of like America, and they dont want to fully switch to one team or the other.
The problem is, that hybrid system is no longer tenable. and people are going to kick and scream for as long as possible before they realize they have to draw a line in the sand and choose a side.
No thanks.
We have enough right-wingers in Europe already.
So, when you generalize canada in your mind right-wingers is what comes to mind? Or just the govt?
Hard to call Canada not right wing when basically 90% of the country is voting for central right and far right parties. Liberals haven't been even slightly left leaning for a long time. The most generous way to describe them is a party that uses left leaning policies to achieve right leaning goals.
This is from a European view and while not the US the political spectrum suffers from the same problem.
What some Canadians consider left is only relative.
So this is your 'liberal' party?:
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2024/12/30/cypl-d30.html
And it's a simple verifiable fact that voters decide on the goverment, so maybe it's only in your mind that they're not right-wingers.
Maybe it's an uncomfortable truth?
No...our "liberal" left-wing party is the NDP.
Almost 45% of our voting population are voting for the Conservatives. That’s a lot of people who desperately want to be the 51st state and live under authoritarianism and fascism.
Why they don’t just move there is beyond me. I would gladly see every single Conservative voter move to the America they want us to be. Canada don’t need them or their kind.
You know damn well that 60+% of that 45% have no idea what you are talking about if you say the words "51st state".
I am all for shitting on conservatives and liberals alike. But let's at least be honest with ourselves before smugly wiping.
I have no interest in Canada joining the EU, which I see as having a bunch of governance problems of their own, but being close allies with well-integrated and mutually supportive economies via trade and other agreements sounds good to me.
Honestly, the idea floated that Canada would form a bloc with the UK, other commonwealth countries, and the EU, then have that bloc negotiate trade agreements with China sounds absolutely ideal to me. That's apparently already been raised by Carney in private talks on his visits to Europe and the UK. It would unite most of the world and cut the US off unless they changed course on their insane path. That's the foundation for a much more positive world order
Wrong.
Canada should join BRICS
Nah, those countries that are behind that are authoritarians.
As expected from a lemmy.ml comment...
Authoritarians? You mean glorious communists! /s
Hungary is in the EU, but they're white so it doesn't bother you.
@[email protected] said those countries are authoritarian, and your response is to say "so is this one, and you're racist"?
You're not even denying Sunshine's claim, you're just redirecting to a different topic and attacking the beliefs you prescribed to someone else. Just strawmen and ad hominem attacks. Nice.
Comparing Hungary to China and Russia is like comparing a mosquito to a rabid dog. Yes, Hungary is annoying within the EU, has undemocratic tendencies and Orban should be dealt with, but Russia and China are full on authoritarian regimes. You know this, so you are either a troll or a shill.
either a troll or a shill.
A tankie. To her credit, though, sometimes she makes good points about topics related to communism like class warfare and how exploitative capitalism is. This was not one of those times, unfortunately.
Just a really bad shill take of supporting the authoritarian-"communist" countries that conveniently ignore the communist ideals of no hierarchical power structures and being run by the people.
Here's the baseless accusation out of nowhere and no I do not like Hungary as Orban has been cracking down on press freedom, persecuting lgbtq+ folks and has been consistently enabling Putin's crimes against humanity.
Yes, let's join the countries that run on slavery! Then the conservatives don't have to hide their plans to convert Canada into the North American branch of China's slave labour industry.
Canada uses prison labor. They rent out prisoners to private firms for rock bottom wages.
But that's different, right?
Care to explain that a bit? I'm not that familiar with BRICS beyond the first paragraph of its Wiki page
There's a few BRICS member and partner countries in the Western hemisphere already: Brazil, Bolivia, and Cuba. In addition to the current members, the US is pissing all over its partners in Latin America and I think we can expect even more countries to join. If the US really is declining, Canada has to think about who its partners in the Western hemisphere are going to be.
But why join BRICS over the EU? (asking because I don't know)
Russia and China are involved with Brics. We do not want to become more like them.
Thanks. I'll give the rest of that BRICS Wikipedia page a glance over to find out more
It would definitely be a good read!
Ok we'll take that under consideration lol. 🤡
If we write off the US what does that do to our standard of living?
Assuming pipelines are obviously orders of magnitude more efficient than shipping by tanker. It also then still requires a pipeline to the east coast as a first step, which we cant get built due to Quebec, who ironically import all their energy from the US. All these costs and we then have to compete with countries on that continent who can build pipelines to Europe.
Given our small population we are the 4th largest exporter of oil and our loonie essentially tracks oil prices, hence it makes up such a large component of our standard of living. This idea we can pivot seems silly at first glance, but I'd like a differing opinions if one exists.
Maybe if we are so economically dependent on a finite substance that damages every part of the planet it touches, we should think of changing the priorities of our economy. Quebec is great at producing energy with its hydroelectric plants generating about 1/3 of all electricity generated in Canada. Quebec is also decent at saving energy being only the 8th largest energy use per capita of the provinces.
It is just wrong to claim Quebec imports all its energy from the US when Quebec actually exports a lot of electricity to the US while importing fossil fuels. Quebec could be far more energy independent if it focused on electrifying more stuff, the opposite is true for fossil fuels in Quebec.