this post was submitted on 29 Mar 2024
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Oh, and also the loss of all of the rest of us who will suffer under another Trump administration.
But fuck the poor, minorities, LGBT folk. We have to show the DNC how principled we are by making sure a fascist is elected!
It's up to the voters to make an informed fucking choice. That's the point of citizenship. Voting isn't a fucking popularity contest, it's a civic duty.
How the fuck does that at all address the point I was making?
If Biden loses, that's the loss of just about everyone who isn't a right-wing straight cis white male Christian. It's not "Oh, it's just the big meanies in the DNC :( who will lose because I think purity tests in the name of losing to fascists are just a Legitimate Choice(tm)". It's. Us.
Exactly. So don't put the blame on the voters if the DNC can't put up a candidate the voters actually want to vote for. It's the voters job to pick who they want to vote for, it's not the voters job to vote for whomever the DNC tells them to vote for. You have the burden of responsibility backward.
So let me get this straight: it's the DNC's responsibility to make sure that the winner of the primary DOESN'T get the nomination, because the voters don't want him, despite having voted for him?
Believe it or not, most people aren't interested in another candidate. "Generic Democrat Who I Can Project All My Views On" outperforms Biden, but no one who is actually running does.
DNC actively subverted the primary process this year, so no, the results of this election are 100% on Biden (and his unappealing candidacy).
Yeah, remember when NH made sure Biden was the only guy on the ballot, and he still lost?
No, actually I remember Biden fumbling right out of the gate by not even doing the minimum to register in NH.
I also remember his admin working with the DNC to contact state committees asking them to cancel primaries outright, which several did. Very cool, very democratic.
For that matter, Biden also seemed content to nap in his bunker instead of engage with other primary candidates to promote his ideas. He seems to be leaning quite heavily on the strategy of “not trump” will be enough for him. Pretty irrespinsible if you ask me, considering his claims of democracy being on the line. Why can’t Biden make his case?
It's the DNC's responsibility to put pressure on the candidate that wasn't sure if they were going to run to not run because the polls showed him getting beat. It's also their responsibility to not change the primaries to heavily favor one candidate like making South Carolina (the place where Biden's luck in 2019 changed) the first official primary.
And that is also the DNC's problem. They didn't put forth a viable candidate in the primaries despite all the polling suggesting they should.
So now it is the DNC's responsibility to put pressure on the scales to change the candidate....
... except when it's not? Very coherent, 10/10 worldview.
"They didn't put forth"
Tell me you don't understand primaries without telling me you don't understand primaries. Not to mention that explicitly contradicts your previous point about not wanting the DNC to pick the candidates. Jesus fucking Christ. We're done here.
Here let me point out the parts you seemed to have missed:
The polls showed they shouldn't favor the candidate they did. They chose against what was obvious instead of encouraging others to run they picked their favored candidate before it even started.
You're right, the wording there isn't correct. It should be that they didn't encourage others to run.
Unfortunately it appears the voters are thinking the same thing. That's why it's the party's responsibility field the best candidate.
Yeah, that's what I would expect from someone who expects voters to toe the line for the party instead of blaming the party for a bad candidate. Do as you say or be ignored right?
If the voters are too stupid to vote against Trump by voting for Biden, that is on them.
Biden hasn't done anything to screw over US citizens. Yes, he continues some shitty foreign policies by supporting Israel and hasn't achieved as much as he wanted because of GOP obstruction, but he has done some positive stuff.
Trump never did anything positive at all, and tried to overthrow the government.
Real tough choice there!
But maybe if fascism wins this time, we'll magically get a left-wing government afterwards? It's like a pendulum!
Sorry that I didn't make it clear I was speaking about his time as president, since he is running for reelection as president. Your point that nobody can ever be forgiven for doing things wrong in the past is absolutely the best logical action.
Why vote for someone who had done the right things for the past couple decades just because their opponent tried to overthrow the government?
Nope. That's on the candidate.
I mean, I agree with you. It's an obvious choice and I can't put my mind in the headspace of anyone that can vote for Trump at this point. Usually I can at least understand the opposition's point of view. I will definitely be voting for Biden... However, that doesn't change the fact that it is up to the party and the candidate to earn the votes, it's not up to the voters to cover for the party.
Biden appeals to most of the Democratic voters, which is why he is their candidate and why he won in 2020.
Unaffiliated voters expecting him to appeal to them specifically is on those voters, not the Dems.
It’s like people didn’t notice how the GOP shrank down to core fanatics and dems won by expanding the tent in their own party.
Now these people think the same level of ideological compromise that should define congress apparently has no place in their own party.
NEWSFLASH: if you refuse to participate unless your ideological purity test is met, you should prob go join the tea party.
Get over it and grow up. A capable, national political party will clearly include people other than you, viewpoints other than yours, and you won’t always get what you want.
Work with people instead of working selfishly against everyone not 100% aligned with your own mental utopia. Your purity test is not a reason to flip the table.
Except if the Democrats want to win.
So don't appeal to the Dem party voters, appeal to other people who have an extremely wide variety of expectations that apparently don't align with the Dems.
Sound logic!
Anything but citizens accepting responsibility for their actions in a democracy. ANYTHING but that!
There is nothing saying a voter has to vote or that a candidate has to run. We both voluntarily take part in this transaction and it's up to the candidate to earn the votes of the voters.
No, there isn't.
But a voter not voting is still making a choice, and they are responsible for that choice.
The candidates aren't lords, and we aren't peasants. In a republic, CITIZENS are responsible for who they vote OR DON'T VOTE for.
There's no choice you can make where you lack responsibility. Whatever happens - it is our fault as citizens. If you can answer to your conscience in the case of a Trump presidency... well, gods help you, because I can't.
I’ll be doing my civic duty by not voting. Voting is supposed to be about picking the candidate I want. Well, I don’t want either of these two candidates, and I won’t stand for the DNC rubbing its greedy little fingers together in the background, making deals and concessions with whomever they have to in order to push their candidate of choice.
Biden has done some good things. Honestly more than I expected. This does not now, nor has it ever, and nor will it ever give the DNC carte blanche to manipulate the primaries from the shadows to choose their preferred candidate to represent the party in a wide-open field of two people once every four years.
You want someone to blame for the fact that you’re all sweating bullets about how this election turns out? Look to the DNC when you want to point fingers, not the people who they’re trying to sucker into voting for the damage control option every four years.
"Please don't blame me for standing by as fascists ascend to power, I don't want to take responsibility for my actions"
Voting is about using your power as a citizen to improve the country. Civic duty - not a popularity contest.
He's not the one standing by. It's the DNC that chose the only candidate that could lose to Trump because they feel he is entitled to it. Just like they chose Hillary in 2016 because it was "her time." These are losses brought on by themselves that affects everyone. Don't be mad at the voters, be mad at the party that is struggling to beat an insurrectionist with multiple ongoing criminal court cases.
... do you not remember that Hillary was elected in the primary?
Jesus fucking Christ.
Signed, a 2016 and 2020 Bernie voter.
Yes, I remember the super delegates that they got rid of because they were used to tip the scales and the DNC giving Hillary the debate questions before the debates so she could be extra prepared.
Also a 2016 and 2020 Bernie voter and donor.
Clearly you don't remember, since Hillary won the greater number of elected delegates, and the 'Super Delegates' only ended up relevant as a Hail Mary pass for the Bernie campaign.
You're the one not remembering... The super delegates were all called extremely early in the race for Hilary in an attempt to make it look like Bernie was so far behind he could never catch up.
And he didn't.
You're ready to hand over the USA to christofascists because Bernie was a worse campaigner than Hillary. That's pathetic, you sore loser.
I say this as someone who donated over $1000 to Bernie in 2016.
Thank you for covering my poor 25$ donating ass in 2016 o7
Isn’t it weird to you that not even Bernie says or thinks this?
That Bernie continues to work with the very folks you refuse to vote for? Almost like it’s not an issue to the very person it should be…
Almost like you’ve got it wrong and even Bernie has moved on to do more for your political views by collaborating WITH the very dems you refuse to support.
Bernie and people like him are accomplishing more for your political goals by working WITH the DNC. Accomplishing more than you will ever accomplish with your sanctimonious BS pretending like the DNC made you a victim.
Then don't fucking complain when people do it.
Putting fascists in power is improving the country? Wow. This is some brave new form of leftism, I guess, that I'm just too right-wing to understand.
Making white liberals uncomfortable enough to bring them to the table to negotiate by threatening not to cast a ballot for them is certainly improving things.
Fucking lmao.
You can laugh -god knows we all need something to laugh at- but look at how fucking irate y'all get about it.
Yeah, we get so irate about the prospect of fascism. Silly us. We should be like the REAL enlightened leftists, and cheer fascism's rise on.
My turn- LMAO if you think voting for biden will put an end to fascism.
Forgive me for seeing "Not putting fascism forward another ten steps" as better than "Putting fascism forward another ten steps".
Voting is a chess move, not a love letter, although I doubt you're actually a US citizen.
I certainly hope you aren't a minority that will lose their citizenship & be exiled under Trump's Project 2025.
I’m not the Chess Master. I’m a pawn. I’m sacrificed and threatened and told if I don’t do what I need to all the time always then the other side wins.
So I’m not going to move the way I’m told until I get something I want.
I’m a minority setting myself on fire every election. This time I’m inclined to have others burn with me.