this post was submitted on 29 Jun 2024
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Stay Mad, Tankies (lemmy.world)
submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
 
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[–] [email protected] 190 points 1 year ago (11 children)

I am a tankie and voting for Biden lmao. The Prolitariat must be protected till enough class conciousness is achieved for Socialism to succeed.

[–] [email protected] 75 points 1 year ago (1 children)

THANK YOU. It's that fkin simple.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 year ago (1 children)

So simple, yet so hard for so many to understand.

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[–] [email protected] 66 points 1 year ago (1 children)

You sound like a rational tankie, which by the definitions that lemmies have explained to me, would make you not a tankie.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (5 children)

"Anyone who thinks themselves a tankie is too self aware to be one" sounds like one of those fallacies you'd learn about in highschool. (What is a tankie, btw? I've been too scared to ask...)*

[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 year ago (2 children)

A tankie is, broadly, someone who wants to effect left-wing ideology using authoritarian methods. It originally referred to those who defended the USSR using tanks to suppress the Hungarian Revolution, but it could be aptly used to describe those who defend China's actions in Tiananmen Square. It's rightfully used as a perjorative, since authoritarian enforcement is antithetical to leftism, particularly communism.

Tankies are hypocrites who didn't understand their self-proclaimed ideologies. If someone's idea of communist praxis is lining up dissenters for the firing squad, you're dealing with a tankie.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 year ago (2 children)

wants to effect left-wing ideology using authoritarian methods

Odd. I'm getting called a tankie because I just won't vote for Biden (or Trump). Someone must have gotten confused.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago

By their reasoning:

No vote for Biden is a vote for Trump. Trump is fascist and authoritarian. Tankies are authoritarians. Therefore, you are a tankie. /s

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago (6 children)

Lots of people say lots of silly things, nonetheless Trump is worse for the proletariat than Biden, and turning your nose up at the lesser evil endangers real people when the greater evil wins. You don't have to vote for the greater evil to help tip the scales in their favor. Accelerationism is authoritarianism with extra steps and no one in the driver's seat.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (5 children)

Tankies are hypocrites who didn’t understand their self-proclaimed ideologies.

Tankies are very frequently the only people in the room who've done the reading. If you believe that so called "authoritarian methods" are antithetical to leftism, then I recommend you read the following pamphlet by Engels.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (13 children)

Tankies have read Marx and Engels, yes, but there are many other forms of leftism and even other forms of communism that aren't ML. You are right about ML communists, in particular, but many other leftist movements are anti-authoritarian by their nature, so the point still stands.

Also, it's possible to do the reading and disagree with the methods of implementation. I agree with the economics and the stated goals of communism, but I don't believe authoritarianism is the best way to go about it.

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

I'm a tankie. What tankie is supposed to mean is someone who blindly supports anything anyone does so long as they claim to be communist and wave a red flag. There's maybe a handful of edgy teens who actually fit that description, but the way it's actually used is to punch left at anyone who supports anything a socialist country has ever done, or who is insufficiently patriotic/nationalistic and is willing to consider things from an internationalist perspective.

If you say for example that Cuba under Castro had a successful literacy program, then there are people who will accuse you of being a tankie just for that. Because it gets used this way, some people like myself chose to reclaim the insult and wear it proudly.

Generally, the actual term for most "tankies" would be Marxist-Leninist. But I actually prefer tankie because it's a more general, big tent label. It's used so broadly that even anarchists can be called tankies. It's basically like "woke" where it doesn't actually have any real meaning.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Well I think there are probably a half dozen interpretations that people on Lemmy use. One I have heard repeated is that they view the Tiananmen Square event as something that China rightfully did... hence "Tankie"

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 year ago

The idea that that's the origin of the term is a common misconception. The actual origin was about the USSR under Kruschev sending in the military in response to a rebellion in Hungary. Some British communists supported the move, while other communists opposed it and labeled the supporters as tankies.

But regardless of the origin, it's changed to where now it's liberals using it to criticize socialists in general.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago

I am by no means an expert, but the test that was explained to me is that if you look at the famous tianamen square picture of the guy holding grocery bags facing down a line of tanks, and then proceed to side with the line of tanks, then you're a tankie.

When I say that I am not an expert, what I actually mean is that I'm a random idiot from the internet, so don't take anything I say as gospel truth.

I've only been on lemmy for a few months, and I've never heard the term tankie on any other platform. My understanding is that a tankie is a militant supporter of communism, who completely disregards (or is in support of) how every time it's ever actually been done it turns into an authoritarian dictatorship (or something similarly unpleasant to live under).

My own biases exposed: I am an american, and most of what I know I learned in the absolutely fucked american public education system, which says communism = evil, because of the red scare a while back.

If you do some googling, there's a wikipedia article on the subject. I've forgotten most of the content of that article shortly after I read it, I should look at it again and maybe it will stick this time.

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[–] [email protected] 59 points 1 year ago (2 children)

And I'd vote for a corpse before I vote for 34 time Convicted Felon Donald Trump. Eat the rich. Pack the courts. Seize the assets of felonious companies.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Mother fucker could be Dracula for all I care. Still voting for him.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (3 children)
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[–] [email protected] 40 points 1 year ago (36 children)

You get it! We can't fuck over vulnerable people. We can't abandon minorities and LGBT people. Even if we let things get worse to the point of a societal collapse, a lot of people will die because of it -- and societal collapse has not historically led to better societies down the road.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 year ago (1 children)

That's such an important point. Anyone who thinks a win by Trump will somehow speed up the advent of socialism is just deluded.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 year ago (2 children)

My trans friends are what keeps me committed to voting Biden no matter how disappointed I am in him. Things are already really scary for them right now and I can't be complicit in making them worse, even through inaction.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago (4 children)

I am trans and not voting for Biden. I refuse to sacrifice Palestinians for my own safety or the safety of my loved ones. All the stuff people say now about them being an acceptable sacrifice or there being nothing they can do about it, that's what they'll be saying about us tomorrow. Solidarity between marginalized groups is the only viable strategy for long term survival.

I hate being used as a rhetorical token to make people feel better about selling out another vulnerable group.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

If you actually cared you would vote biden. No one capable of it will save the Palestinians. None. At least with biden someone survives.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

If our "democracy" has decayed to the point where I'm not able to vote on whether or not we do a genocide, then it is not a democracy and I should not legitimize the sham through participation.

There is no circumstance under which I will support genocide. If that means I die, then I will die. If any of you had a backbone you'd do the same. And if enough people drew that line, they'd have no choice but to listen to us.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

I respect this decision. But, I’m selfishly voting for Biden. Trump’s first term stressed me out.

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[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 year ago

Most based .ml user

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 year ago

Based and practicalpilled

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago

Thank you for being a sane human 🙏

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

The Prolitariat must be protected

By consenting to corruption and a path to WWIII. That is not protecting them, in fact it is ensuring them a terrible future. If you cared about them, you would vote, volunteer, donate, and support the PSL, CPUSA, or Green party instead.

[–] [email protected] 43 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Lmao the green party isn't going to do jack shit. They're completely unserious about politics. They aren't even trying to build up an infrastructure in all 50 states that lets them get suffused into local and state politics. They aren't even aiming for Congressional seats, which would be necessary for an actual Green president to get anything done.

They're just anti science grifters who think wifi causes cancer, entertain vaccine skepticism, and demonize nuclear energy -- the latter of which could be a major asset to stopping global warming. Newer designs are even able to consume nuclear waste, meaning an anti nuclear position results in more waste than we would otherwise.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Then support the PSL. I work with the Green party to improve it, because that's how democracy works. It's okay you don't understand that.

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

None of those parties have a ghost of a chance of winning, and with as razor thin as the win margins were in 2016 and 2020, I'm not confident Biden will win if we don't vote for him. I sincerely hope I do not have to explain why Trump would be worse on literally every issue (especially Gaza) than Biden is.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Then do something about it instead of complain. I am, what are you doing? You vote for corruption.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Bro's protest voting when the ~~Weimar~~ American Republic has Nazis on the ballot and thinks building "grassroots support" for the twentieth year in a row justifies it when the world is about to run out of time anyways

You want Green candidates? Tell them to run as Democrats or make a fucking militia.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (24 children)

Dems are actually fascists, and you are as well for not only voting for them, but gathering support for them online when you could be doing that for a decent party.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Yes, yes, we all know what happens when you scratch a liberal but it's better than not having to scratch to find it. Even if all that's holding the powers that be back is a skin-deep veneer of civility and deniability a vote to strip that veneer away makes you a fool, not a revolutionary.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (5 children)

Nobody likes voting for the lesser of two evils, but we all have to if we want to stop an even further decline into hell. Our system is broken, and we don't have any way of fixing it immediately, so we have to work with what we can. Trump as president will have immediate and direct consequences for many people, and it will be the fault of people like you that it happened. At this point, not voting for Biden is the same thing as voting for Trump. You may continue virtue signaling after we get through the crisis right in front of us.

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