this post was submitted on 15 Apr 2024
670 points (100.0% liked)

politics

23206 readers
3590 users here now

Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!

Rules:

  1. Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.

Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.

Example:

  1. Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
  2. Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
  3. No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
  4. Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
  5. No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.

That's all the rules!

Civic Links

Register To Vote

Citizenship Resource Center

Congressional Awards Program

Federal Government Agencies

Library of Congress Legislative Resources

The White House

U.S. House of Representatives

U.S. Senate

Partnered Communities:

News

World News

Business News

Political Discussion

Ask Politics

Military News

Global Politics

Moderate Politics

Progressive Politics

UK Politics

Canadian Politics

Australian Politics

New Zealand Politics

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

While rebutting another post here on Lemmy, I ran into this. This says exactly what I want to say.

I am not a friend of Biden's Administration. I think they drug their feet over a variety of things ranging from holding Trump and his goons accountable for January 6th through rulemaking on issues like OTC Birth Control and abortion rights, and yes, I think he's too quick to please big business. But then I remember what the alternative is, and ... well, disappointed in Biden or not, I'm voting for him. Because my wife is a Black bisexual goth woman, four strikes under Team Pepe's tent. And I have my own strikes for marrying her as a White dude, and respecting her right to not have kids since she doesn't want them is another strike against me. And I care about my Non-Christian, Gay, Transgender, and Minority friends, and will never willingly subject them to Team Pepe.

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 59 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Democratic strategists, liberal pundits are making a living off doubting President Joe Biden's viability in the 2024 presidential election. Why?

Because they need it to be a horse race to get keep people's attention. They write those things because they get clicks and views and comments.

Notice how they're not writing about how our system is failing everyone by being this way. That's because they like the system this way because it keeps them on top.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 year ago (3 children)

If you think the system is failing us now, you must have been asleep from 2017 through 2020, especially for the part where unmarked, literally secret as in unknown, police came in and abducted people protesting the murder of a Black dude, and beat the shit out of them before releasing them. The system REALLY failed us then.

I get it. You think the Democrats don't represent your issues in the Congress. I don't agree with that, as a good half of the achievements listed here benefit the little guy in one way or another, but yeah. Biden answers to the moneyed class, and that is bipartisan. But you only get 26 out of 100 people in the room to flat out come out and say "Yeah, I'm with that guy," pointing to you. In the polls, you might net another 25 people, and 49 people vote for the R in this accursed D and R duopoly we call our government. But pay attention to those numbers. You can't afford to lose a lot of people. If Jill Stein picks off 3 of your 51 people, it's 49 Trump, 48 Biden, 3 Stein, and all 51 of the anti-Trump voters suffer with Trump. Those are the rules the game is played by.

As I said to the other person arguing that it's wrong to expect people to vote for people who don't give them exactly what they want, I agree. We need better choices. But there are smart ways to go about doing this, and dumb ways to go about doing it. And allowing the authoritarian jerk in isn't just a dumb way to go about doing it. It's a dumb and cruel way. And understand if you're a White Liberal choosing to vote Third Party or stay home and not vote Joe Biden the Genocidal Monster: you are benefiting from your White Privilege. You, like me, can keep your head down and pretend to be a Loyal Member of the Race, a Good American who pays your taxes and salutes the flag. You can scrub your Social Media posts and hide behind your anonymity on places like Lemmy, and go about your life. You will not be the first put into the cages by the Trump ICE. You will not be the first rounded up and deported to a foreign land with no citizenship. You will not be the first detained by the military during protests. Many, many people will pay the price for your privilege of voting third party or staying home because you won't vote for no 'genocider'. But remember two things First, you will have brought the genocide you say you oppose onto American shores. Second, once they are done with the migrants, the transgender people, the gays, the 'sinful' women protesting their rights to get a safe abortion, and so on, there'll be nobody left to protect you when they turn their attention to you.

Again. Biden ain't no bed of roses. But one of two people will win in 2024, just like one of two people would win in 2020, and one of two people would win in 2016. I consider you all who voted Stein or Johnson in 2016 or stayed home in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania to be responsible for what Trump did in 2017 through 2020, and if Trump wins in 2024, I'll hold you all accountable for what happens in 2025 and beyond.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 year ago (3 children)

tl;dr - The system is broken but we still have to pretend it isn't because otherwise its brokenness will allow terrible things to happen and the people who do those things will face no repercussions.

load more comments (3 replies)
[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago

you are benefiting from your White Privilege

This is no longer effective rhetoric in 2024

if Trump wins in 2024, I'll hold you all accountable for what happens in 2025 and beyond

Why should anyone care about you or your opinions? You don't have the power to "hold" anyone "accountable". So don't pretend that you do

The working class deserves Medicare for All as a right, universal housing as a right, and living wages as a right. The working class has no interest in seeing its money sent to fund genocide in Gaza or a seemingly endless war in Ukraine against Russian aggression.

Unfortunately Biden does not represent the working class, he represents the ruling class, as does Trump. The working class is disillusioned with American bourgeois democracy and their upcoming nonparticipation in the presidential election could quite possibly result in another Trump victory. If that occurs then it will purely be the fault of Biden and the Democratic Party

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago (2 children)

you think the system is failing us now, you must have been asleep from 2017 through 2020, especially for the part where unmarked, literally secret as in unknown, police came in and abducted people protesting the murder of a Black dude, and beat the shit out of them before releasing them. The system REALLY failed us then.

Straw man argument, those police are not part of the executive branch, nor were they punished or prohibited from doing so again by the new executive.

get it. You think the Democrats don't represent your issues in the Congress. I don't agree with that, as a good half of the achievements listed here benefit the little guy in one way or another, but yeah. Biden answers to the moneyed class, and that is bipartisan. But you only get 26 out of 100 people in the room to flat out come out and say "Yeah, I'm with that guy," pointing to you. In the polls, you might net another 25 people, and 49 people vote for the R in this accursed D and R duopoly we call our government. But pay attention to those numbers. You can't afford to lose a lot of people. If Jill Stein picks off 3 of your 51 people, it's 49 Trump, 48 Biden, 3 Stein, and all 51 of the anti-Trump voters suffer with Trump. Those are the rules the game is played by.

I think this is ignoring op's main point.... That the inherent problems that are causing the vast majority of our problems have gone largely unaddressed by both the democratic and Republican party. COVID marked the largest wealth transfer from the middle and lower class to the rich in our nation's history, and we weren't doing so great before that. So unless Biden is hell bent on a very progressive tax scheme that would transfer more of that hoarded money back into the system...... I would hesitate to really claim he's doing anything meaningful.

As I said to the other person arguing that it's wrong to expect people to vote for people who don't give them exactly what they want, I agree. We need better choices. But there are smart ways to go about doing this, and dumb ways to go about doing it.

You are conflating someone wanting more choices, or wantinf someone like Joe Biden to change his stance/policy based on what the vast majority of his voters want.

The complaint isn't that Joe Biden isn't exactly what I want, it's that every time someone lays valid criticism at his feet and army of simps comes out to defend him with comparisons to trump.

And allowing the authoritarian jerk in isn't just a dumb way to go about doing it. It's a dumb and cruel way. And understand if you're a White Liberal choosing to vote Third Party or stay home and not vote Joe Biden the Genocidal Monster: you are benefiting from your White Privilege.

Again, op didn't say that he was going to vote third party, he just made valid complaints. In stead of saying, well yeah, we should probably change our position on that, you equated his complaint to racism.

You, like me, can keep your head down and pretend to be a Loyal Member of the Race, a Good American who pays your taxes and salutes the flag. You can scrub your Social Media posts and hide behind your anonymity on places like Lemmy, and go about your life. You will not be the first put into the cages by the Trump ICE. You will not be the first rounded up and deported to a foreign land with no citizenship. You will not be the first detained by the military during protests. Many, many people will pay the price for your privilege of voting third party or staying home because you won't vote for no 'genocider'.

Again, a strawman argument, mixed with some unprompted race baiting. I for one am not white, and have several complaints with Joe Biden and his presidency.

Again. Biden ain't no bed of roses.

Which is inherently the problem. If progressive voters are staying at home, it's not the fault of the voter. It's the fault of the democratic party for claiming a geriatric center right is the best the party has to offer.

This is like blaming the progressive party for Hillary loosing, despite polling worse than Bernie in swing states. And despite her ignoring Michigan on the campaign trail.

This is why Democrats loose elections, because they would rather loose running a center right than win with an actual left leaning candidate.

My vote is inconsequential, living in a deep red state and what have you. But, I'm not mystified why people would stay home or vote third party. It's upsetting, but my discontent is largely aimed at the party who refuses to change based on their constituents wants/needs. That when I have complaints about their neoliberal economics, or their participation in an ethnic cleansing, I get told by some white liberal that Im just "benefitting from my (non-existent)white privilege".

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 53 points 1 year ago (12 children)

You're ignoring the big elephant in the room. This whole "lesser evilism" schtick that the bootlicker Dems have been relying on since 2016? It's inevitably going to hit rock-bottom - and soon, too.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

The two party system always comes down to who runs the least shittiest candidate.

For me. That's not always who wins.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago (2 children)

And as soon as the shittiest one wins, the bar for "least shittiest" drops a whole lot lower - it's a race to the bottom.

Of course, none of this affects policy - the class who benefits from the status quo will get what they want irregardless of who is in the Waffle House.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (5 children)

Tell me you're not a student of history without telling me you're not a student of history.

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago

"lesser evilism" is the entire system, since nearly the beginning.

load more comments (9 replies)
[–] [email protected] 50 points 1 year ago (6 children)

And the Democratic Party needs to pull its head out of its ass and embrace its base, rather than smugly scheme in ways that are ruining lives.

I have no problem with Biden’s job as president. In fact, I got into a big argument with someone a few weeks ago because they keep parroting anti-Biden propaganda from astroturfed pro-Palestine social media groups.
Biden has been doing a great job for the most part, on a number of fronts.

But I’m sort of bittersweet on that, because the harder I look, the more I see the illusion of choice, and an intentional effort to barely keep up with the will of the people.

2016, Bernie vs Clinton. He had the votes, but the party pulled some superdelegate shenanigans to give it to Clinton. And with the same confidence of someone who had just been handed a layup in the primary, she managed to smugly fumble the presidency by a tiny margin.
Post 2020 - Democrats had a majority, and instead of doing things the populous wanted, they wrung their hands about two candidates the Democratic Party had helped elect - Sinema and Manchin - and whether or not they were going to block bills.
The other day I did a deep dive into Elissa Slotkin - a candidate so unlikeable she had to move to a much more certain democratic district when districts were redrawn. When the senate seat came up, the Democratic Party cut deals with more liberal candidates who are vastly more likable, to get them to not run in the primary. So now Michigan is going to wind up with an unwanted centrist that used to be an ‘analyst’ for the CIA during the Iraq war. She’s going to pretend to be a democrat while being the same sort of heel the Sinema or Manchin was.

That’s just the people. In their post 2020-majority they could have done so much legislatively that they didn’t even bother considering - like campaign finance reform or expanding the courts, or even changing the rules around judicial nominees to prevent future shenanigans, but that would impact their bottom line or their ability to inspire panic at election-time. They could have strengthened the ACA, but that hurts some of the corporations that donate to them. Or do things to help people so that their rights wouldn’t be at risk - like codifying Roe, instead of allowing it to continue to be a wedge issue that destroys lives, but gets people to vote.

The Democratic (and Republican) Party is playing us all.
I’m not disaffected with Biden. I’m disaffected with a political party that nakedly fucks around to preserve the status quo, rather than embracing their base and winning with an encouraged and engaged populous. They lack the mandate to lead because they only desire to govern. (In contrast to the Republicans which lack the mandate to lead, are unable to govern, and only desire power and to abuse the government for personal gain.)

So go ahead, give me the downvotes.
This wouldn’t be an issue if we had ranked choice and a coalition government instead of this ‘winner take all’ nonsense that just incentivizes entrenchment rather than inspiration. But, you know, that doesn’t help the businesses that are political parties, so they ain’t gonna vote on it.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago (5 children)

In their post 2020-majority they could have done so much legislatively that they didn’t even bother considering - like campaign finance reform or expanding the courts, or even changing the rules around judicial nominees to prevent future shenanigans, but that would impact their bottom line or their ability to inspire panic at election-time.

This conspiracy theory is so weird.

How exactly are legislative Democrats supposed to accomplish these things when their bare-bones Senate majority depends on Manchin and Sinema? I mean really, specifically, how are they supposed to get things done?

Y'all are always like "they should do more" but you won't give them the numbers to do it. In a 60/40 Senate we can make wonderful things happen, but you just won't give it to us.

load more comments (5 replies)
load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 39 points 1 year ago (22 children)

I’ll be one of the first to admit, I don’t like Biden. But, if you need to be convinced that he’s better than Trump, you’re an absolute buffoon!! Trump is worse than the shit you stepped on, on your walk. Trump is the worst thing to ever happen to the American presidency. He’s the closest we’ll get to Adolf Hitler and he relishes in that. He thinks it makes him “a bad boy” or someone moving against the curve…and he’s right, he’s moving against the curve. He’s moving against it in 4 straight lines that will bend consecutively in 90° angles to the right. My point is, TRUMP IS NAZI SCUM WHO’S WORSE THAN THE SHIT ON YOUR HEEL

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago (6 children)

Yeah, there are some leftists that try drawing the line at silly points like "oh I won't vote for someone who supports genocide" but really what's the big deal? Genocides happen, I think they're kind of fun sounding. I'm thinking about moving to Israel and helping the IDF finish their extermination of the barbaric "human animals"/natives that have infested their holy land. Biden has self-identified as a Zionist many times before, and I think that's a beautiful thing. I bet he'd take up arms with me against the parasites if he was still fully sentient. He's definitely trying his best as president to help them finish cleaning up the trash.

Oh, and yeah only Trump is a fascist. None of the above sounds anything like fascism, don't worry.

/s

load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (21 replies)
[–] [email protected] 34 points 1 year ago (16 children)

Thanks. Just needed to hear the same shit again from another liberal. I so love election season.

load more comments (16 replies)
[–] [email protected] 31 points 1 year ago (14 children)

Democrats need to pull themselves together and figure out what people actually need and want. The bogeyman isn't a sustainable thing.

load more comments (14 replies)
[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 year ago (20 children)

Most of your grievances are things the POTUS has no unilateral authority over.

Not sure about his direct authority on drug classifications to enable OTC birth control. Also seems weird to focus on since this has been a hotly debated item for decades.

He has zero authority over abortion rights. The SCOTUS made this massive mess, and were enabled by Trumps appointees. This is trumps mess, and checks and balances explicitly prevents the POTUS from dictating this.

Trump prosecution is out of his hands. It's Garland's job. I'm not sure how much influence the POTUS can have here, but more to the point, the POTUS should be staying out of it, particularly since the plaintiff is his political rival. I don't know what his authority is here in the technical sense, but it is appropriate to not have direct influence over the investigation.

Seems like there's a lot of resentment towards Biden because of a general lack of understanding of the power structure of our government.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 year ago (7 children)

But what is he doing, then? He could be taking a firm line against the genocide in Palestine, but instead he is giving public and material support to the perpetrators. He could be rallying the electorate by using the "bully pulpit" to pressure congress with popular policies the public wants. He doesn't do that kind of thing, because they are antithetical to his neoliberal politics. He (and those around him) would rather lose to the right than concede anything to the working class.

Most people understand that the potus is largely a figurehead, but Biden isn't even doing that right. Don't keep blaming the electorate when the problem is with the shitty fucking leadership.

load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (19 replies)
[–] [email protected] 27 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Are we really in a world where the march of 40 years of fervent evangelical christian nationalism is just "Trump and his goons"?

Trump could both die and go to jail today and that ideological shift is going nowhere but onward.

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (6 children)

It's a goddamn shame in what's supposed to be a representative democracy that there are so many calls for those who supposedly should be the ones represented to change their views to conform with those who represent them and not the other way around.

But it's power dynamics, innit? The Biden administration and their wealthy kind won't be that harmed by a Trump administration, so they don't have a lot of motivation to actually change anything. It's those who stand to be horrifically harmed by Biden's opponent who must swallow their morality and vote for monsters lest more harm come to them later on.

load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 year ago (34 children)

Biden may be better than Trump, but the system is fucked to make those the only two options. If he wins, after the election I'm going to actively criticize everything about the Democratic party I can so that we have a chance to get a progressive candidate in 2028. For now I'm giving him a pass so we don't take another step towards fascism. Republicans are going to use absolutely everything they can to squeeze their orange dictator into office.

load more comments (34 replies)
[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago

Dude. This USA Today blog post is from December 2023. It doesn't even mention Israel.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (8 children)

Democrats should get over themselves and push through ranked choice voting in each state they control. Republicans gaining control of the nation is a existential threat, and we should be using every tool to keep them out. This means getting rid of FPTP voting and the spoiler effect inherent in it.

OP, you seem very concerned with how people vote. Have you worked to start an electoral reform campaign in your state? you can entirely solve the spoiler effect that you're concerned with! What are you waiting for?

load more comments (8 replies)
[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (11 children)

Gotta stop lumping all the players in one side together. Biden is not doing anything by himself and neither is the fat orange. Gotta pull out the microscope to see who is who and where and why rather than hitting on a single name. The house and senate are the major string pulling yoyos in everything that comes out of washington

load more comments (11 replies)
[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 year ago (5 children)

We can't limbo with the bar that low please raise it at least past the "not supporting genocide" line

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago (7 children)

A rabid racoon would make a better president than Cheeto Benito..

load more comments (7 replies)
[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 year ago (1 children)

This is where we are at. Choosing between a child murdering Zionist and an insurrectionist facing multiple civil and criminal trials.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

Cmon guys! He's slightly better than a human pile of shit. Go vote! If you don't vote for our babbling, senile, old man it will be 100% your fault if we get stuck with the other shit bag for 4 more years. We carry zero responsibility for proping this senile old man up, it is 100% on you, the voters.

Good thing the Republicans are all idiots, it lowered the bar so fucking low we can do whatever we want. Because we can't possibly go the other way and do something better. We have to take advantage and get away with whatever we can.

-The DNC probably.

Someday the DNC will realize Republicans fall in line, democrats fall in love. Forgetting that gave us Trump over Hillary. The only hope that we don't end up with Trump is us being fueled by hate. I am going to vote, but counting on people to take time off work and wait hours in line to vote only because they are so scared of another possible outcome is the worst reality. But here we are.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 year ago (8 children)

when the bar is on the floor its easy to jump over it. Biden is also better than being boiled alive that doesn't mean I am voting for him

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 year ago (6 children)

Biden is also better than being boiled alive that doesn't mean I am voting for him

If "Everyone gets boiled alive" was on the ballot and had the tiniest chance of passing, you would be an idiot to not vote.

load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (7 replies)
[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago (1 children)

pretty much anyone is better than trump

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago (11 children)

Biden is better than Trump because he (occasionally) listens to what the voters want. Trump tells his followers what they should support, not the other way around.

This also means that people trying to tell Biden to change course sound like Trump supporters to people that believe politicians never listen.

load more comments (11 replies)
load more comments
view more: next ›