this post was submitted on 20 Apr 2024
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[–] [email protected] 112 points 11 months ago (8 children)

Crazy that the proposed solution to propaganda is banning media instead of investing in education that promotes critical thinking. Or maybe the idea here is "no propaganda except mine".

[–] [email protected] 50 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Investing in education is counter to the clear goals of the USA. Smart people would revolt, protest,and you know, hold companies and billionaires accountable. Uneducated people are often poor, can’t afford to fight back and are scared they will lose what little they have.

At some point we need all to fight back, but it might be too late. And worse, too few will join in out of fear of death.

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[–] Anyolduser 30 points 11 months ago (5 children)

Looking at things pragmatically widespread education of the population takes time and simply won't take for some people. There are folks today complaining that "they don't teach taxes in school". These people have a problem filling out a 1040EZ. Not exactly encouraging.

At the same time Tic Tok represents a single vector for current or potential foreign propaganda and intelligence gathering targeting the American public. Opportunities to nip a single bud (so to speak) are few and far between and probably won't be possible in the near future.

TL;DR - The "sell or ban" is a short term measure that won't take a lot of time, education is a long term measure that takes years.

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[–] [email protected] 19 points 11 months ago

If people can pick apart China's propaganda it means they can pick apart US propaganda, too.

Can't have that.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 11 months ago (3 children)

I have to tell you, I know many intelligent people that have succumbed to propaganda, and outrage porn addiction. I see it continue to happen on all sides of the political isle. (This isn't a both sides kind of statement, simply acknowledgement that the same tactics work on our brain, indifferent of political ideology.)

Whether they are hooked on the dopamine rush of rage baiting up votes, likes or comments; or only seeing everything in the world through a myopic lens of negativity, it has captured many of my friends and family, including myself for a time.

For some their drug is Fox News, others it's Reddit, Facebook or TikTok, the results are often the same.

I have yet to figure out a manner in which to communicate with individuals who spend considerable amounts of time in echo chambers, constantly having their personal beliefs reinforced. Evasion of cognitive dissonance and social conflict are very powerful psychological motivations. I wish I knew the solution.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 11 months ago (8 children)

And yet China is banning basically the whole Western internet, foreign companies must enter joint ventures with Chinese companies under government control. Reciprocity is fair. Why should Byte Dance be allowed to take in billions to fund Chinese gulags?

[–] [email protected] 9 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

China does thing: Bad

America does same thing: Good

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Well, of course. They aren't banning Facebook, Instagram or YouTube. That's exactly how they want it.

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[–] [email protected] 39 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Minimum wage has been $7.25/hr for 15 years and this is what they're getting done on Capitol Hill 🤪

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[–] [email protected] 37 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

How about a digital bill of rights that applies to every corporation you fucking cowards!

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[–] [email protected] 31 points 11 months ago (6 children)

I see no issue with banning tik tok.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 11 months ago (17 children)

It's not even "banning tik-tok". It's "separate your interests, or we block your product".

Which isn't exactly something that we haven't seen before in the U.S. and it for sure isn't anything new in China where plenty of services, games....etc are blocked with "Chinese only" versions of those services.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago (4 children)

We forced the sale of Grindr and nobody even brought it up.

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I don't like TikTok, but I do take issue with the government deciding what is and isn't available to me.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Except they would be ignoring all the other shitty social networks but it's a start.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

It's not a start tho, it's killing competition of Facebook and Google. It's consolidating power if anything. I believe this bill has nothing to do with security issues and everything to do with campaign contributions to make sure America never has to compete with another country in this space.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 11 months ago (2 children)

what did tiktok do to deserve being banned, and why is it okay for other companies to do that?

[–] [email protected] 16 points 11 months ago (5 children)

Feeding data to the CCP, helping them identify people who can be easily swayed into espionage. Say someone gets into a position of power. "Hey, remember when you were 12 and said this on tik Tok? Now we need you to be out bitch or we're leaking this."

Look at the things that have gone viral on Tik Tok, it's like their algorithm prioritizes things that are toxic to make American youth shittier. Kia boys comes to mind.

There is also the fact that China bans all American social media out of fear that we'd use it to manipulate their people. If they aren't allowing our businesses to compete fairly, why should we allow theirs? Also, they probably are projecting that fear because they are doing exactly that with TikTok.

The app has more permissions than most apps and is highly invasive. They sent a push notification to all their users based on Geo location saying who their rep was and giving their phone number saying to call them to stop this bill. That alone seems like a major abuse of power. They are using the data they have to try to sway the American politicians already.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 months ago (2 children)

you've failed to answer my second question, which I believe was the important one: why should this behavior be perfectly legal for everyone other than tiktok?

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 11 months ago (4 children)

TikTok is very heavily influenced by the CCP and could be used to collect data from Americans (probably they already are). Not wanting your biggest geopolitical rival to harvest data from your citizens is pretty understandable.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 11 months ago (7 children)

Except for the part where they couldn't get support for it twice so they shoved it in here to get their way? But that's ok because you don't like the silly dancing app that you know basically nothing about right? Other than "China bad", of course.

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 11 months ago (6 children)

Well the Senate killed the earlier bill. There's a decent chance they pass the Ukraine/Israel aid bill without this amendment. It would then be stricken in reconciliation. Unfortunately there's also a decent chance the Senate passes it because this version probably fixes things the Senators had problems with.

If it does get passed there's a very good chance there's a court order to prevent anything until the courts rule on the constitutionality of the law. If Bytedance loses that there's zero chance they sell though. The US market is not big enough for them to jettison an international company.

[–] [email protected] 34 points 11 months ago (5 children)

Why are you cheerleading for TikTok to remain in the hands of a US adversary, during the same week when said adversary forced a US company to abjectly ban US-based messaging apps?

Retaliation. Tit for tit.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 11 months ago (2 children)

If the government can just point at a company and force a fire sale then there is no market, there is no order, there is no financial industry. This is an incredibly dangerous law.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 11 months ago (1 children)

The government absolutely has unconditional and unlimited authority to restrict enemy states from ownership of anything in the US they want to.

There is absolutely no possibility of any Constitutional issue. The government has explicit authority to handle anything they want about international commerce in the Constitution.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 11 months ago (13 children)

That's why they're having to pass this law I guess then? Because they already have the authority to do the thing they're trying to make the law to get the authority to do?

And TikTok isn't owned by China. It's owned by ByteDance, a MultiNational Corp with Chinese ties. It's not operated out of China, Tiktok is operated out of Singapore and Los Angeles.

And what exactly is the security concern of people making funny cat videos? Nobody is saying the government has to put Tiktok on government computers. So what exactly is the exposure here that trumps the first amendment and prohibition on bills of attainder in the US?

[–] [email protected] 9 points 11 months ago (1 children)

To your first point, yes, exactly. Congress mostly has to pass bills to exercise their power. For example: they have the authority to decide finances. They pass bills to (barely) get that done.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 11 months ago (1 children)

The alternative is to outright ban it. Tik Tok is a cancer directly controlled by a hostile nation state. The government absolutely has the right to block foreign interference like this.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 months ago (32 children)

Pray tell how is this any worse than Facebook? Is the CCP in the Los Angeles TikTok office moderating content?

Or is this just more bullshit invented on the spot to justify an unconstitutional power grab?

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 11 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago

It was right there!

[–] [email protected] 18 points 11 months ago

The first amendment doesn't have an exception for retaliation.

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 11 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 18 points 11 months ago (2 children)

mimes eating popcorn, while pointing to overlayed captions, with a Taylor Swift song playing in the background

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 11 months ago (3 children)

It's not even about propaganda it's not having it until their thumb, they can't push a button and ensure the top video under trans on every search is Matt Walsh, and yeah on all other major platforms if you search trans people critical of trans people pop up. The reasoning isn't popularity or engagement, the US government has ordered them to do it through backroom tax deals and Slapp orders. Next stop for the US gov is gonna be the fediverse and AT proto, they are gonna argue that not just anyone should be trusted and that running a social media server is a big task. security blah blah children, protecting your data. Than lass a bill require you to obtain an FCC license to host your own social media site. It only gets worse from here folks

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 11 months ago (6 children)

Weren't you all just hating on Republicans for not voting for that bill.

How about an all bills must be fucking separate bill?

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (5 children)

Oh, no! What will I do without my level 5 gyatt rizz livvy fanum tax dunne rizzing up baby gronk ice spice wat da dawg doin skibidi toilet in real life only in ohio we go jim zyzz creatine alpha sigma cuh dey board?

This bill would also outlaw using VPNs to view such restricted platforms, and has a general policy that would allow lawmakers to ban any platform they claim is a national security risk. No overreach here!

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 11 months ago

Can we just put the american and chinese government in a room and let them fight it out untill they are done?

Just let me watch my funny cat videos and cooking videos in peace thankyou very much.

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