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389

A 3-year-old girl died during an ‘exorcism.’ A judge has now ruled her family can stand trial (www.independent.co.uk)

submitted 10 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 100 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (6 children)

Her mom told investigators that her daughter was possessed and said that God “took” Arely during the exorcism because she was not meant to be a mother.

...

The grandfather told police Claudia said her daughter ‘was not a normal girl.’ When Rene arrived at the ritual, Arely was alive, but her mom said she was going to die, he told investigators.

Defense attorneys have argued the suspects did not intend to kill Arely.

Sure sounds an awful lot like the mother planned for that poor kid to die.

And all this occurred within a church. Where are the charges against the church?

[–] [email protected] 49 points 10 months ago (2 children)

I do at least agree with her that she shouldn't be a mother.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Yeah she should have made this decision much earlier but maybe saving her daughter from a life of misery.

[–] [email protected] 40 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Aborting a pinhead sized embryo is murder in cold blood, but using religious delusions as a shaky excuse for a premeditated murder of an infant is just religious practice people can't be held accountable for.

Ameeericaa, fuck yeah.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago

They’ll definitely be held accountable. To what degree I don’t know, but there has been precedent set to overrule religious expression in the event of murder.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

No, god said that

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

God is dead

[–] [email protected] 1 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

But the article said she said he said...

[–] [email protected] 25 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Mental illness, religion, or murder? Who knows

[–] [email protected] 24 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Why’d you repeat the same thing twice at the start?

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago

It's a bit like saying pasta and spaghetti.

Yeah, spaghetti is pasta, but not all pasta is spaghetti.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago

A healthy cocktail of all three perhaps

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago

Could be attributed to religious psychosis, but sounds like some Casey Anthony shit.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 10 months ago

And all this occurred within a church. Where are the charges against the church?

Oh, haha, first time witnessing religion complicit in criminal activity, huh?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

It's a Pentacostal church, wouldn't be surprised if they do the snake handling thing.

[+] [email protected] 72 points 10 months ago (5 children)

[removed by mod]

[–] [email protected] 25 points 10 months ago

I'd settle for it being widely seen as the ignorant anachronism that it is and their power over secular government being completely wrested.

If an elected leader from my country said that we need to curry favor with Neptune to stop a dry season I'd want them thrown out as would many others probably. But every day we have leaders around the world making decisions based on their Iron Age faith and that's seen as okay...because they're part of the same club? Out of the spirit of acceptance? Personally my acceptance is wearing thin watching these nutjobs break whatever they can. They belong in communes in the woods, not leading nuclear-armed countries.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 months ago

They already are. The diagnosis is schizotypal personality disorder.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

I'm an atheist and think overt religious beliefs are ridiculous, for rational reasons.

However, religious beliefs are so common and dominant that it would never be labelled a mental illness because it clearly isn't. It would be like claiming that after you turn off the lights, every once in a while, you want to hustle up the stairs a bit more quickly because you get a weir feeling, is a mental illness, even if you rationally know you're safe.

It's a natural state that probably has (or comes from) an evolutionary advantage. It's just something we rationally should be able to get ourselves past.

But a mental illness? Not even close.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago (1 children)

“Fifty thousand years ago there were these three guys spread out across the plain and they each heard something rustling in the grass. The first one thought it was a tiger, and he ran like hell, and it was a tiger but the guy got away. The second one thought the rustling was a tiger and he ran like hell, but it was only the wind and his friends all laughed at him for being such a chickenshit. But the third guy thought it was only the wind, so he shrugged it off and the tiger had him for dinner. And the same thing happened a million times across ten thousand generations - and after a while everyone was seeing tigers in the grass even when there weren't any tigers, because even chickenshits have more kids than corpses do. And from those humble beginnings we learn to see faces in the clouds and portents in the stars, to see agency in randomness, because natural selection favours the paranoid. Even here in the 21st century we can make people more honest just by scribbling a pair of eyes on the wall with a Sharpie. Even now we are wired to believe that unseen things are watching us.”

― Peter Watts, Echopraxia

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago

I figured it wasn't an original thought, but this is a great quote that drives the point home.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 10 months ago (3 children)

I don't see how that would work. I was overt religious and left. Did I suddenly go from insane to sane?

[–] [email protected] 17 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Why not? Illnesses can be cured.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I guess.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

It's if you see a differentiation between "mental illness" and "mental disorder". It makes sense that "mental illness" can be something which is detrimental to health or debilitating (like anything that gives a significantly warped and unreasonable perception of reality) and that may be non-lifelong/non-chronic, while "mental disorder/disability" is exclusively neurological differences that are lifelong/chronic and usually apparent during development (Autism, ADHD, mood & anxiety disorders, schizophrenia, etc.), imo.

It's like how "illness" can refer to a spread disease or sickness and isn't just disabilities. I see no reason to separate physical and mental illness from each other. Same with disorders. They're just illness and disorder/disability.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago

Will probably omly bolster their believers

[–] [email protected] 49 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Anyone who seriously thinks a demon can possess a human should be put in jail.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago (2 children)

I think a demon can possess a human. In fact, some of my best friends are demons who stole human bodies.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (4 children)

How do you know they stole them? Might have been a fair exchange.

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[–] [email protected] 27 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Her mom, Claudia Hernandez, 26, uncle, Rene “Aaron” Hernandez Santos, 20, and grandfather, Rene Trigueros Hernandez, 60, were all charged with assault on a child causing death.

Unless there is no way to charge someone with manslaughter when it comes to killing a child, this should at the very least be manslaughter, although I would suggest third degree murder would apply.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 10 months ago

This carries a higher penalty (25 to life, compare with manslaughter's up to 11).

[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago

I’m guessing for murder you have to prove intent or something? Which maybe the prosecution didn’t think they could do for a jury. The defense is obviously going to try to get some Christians on the jury.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 10 months ago

Put the whole clan and anyone from the church involved or with prior knowledge of this behind bars.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 10 months ago (1 children)

God dammit. That poor baby. I just wish we were better.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Is "we" the majority of people around the globe? Because most people around the globe wouldnt do this id wager.

They'd beat her mercilessly and then ~~sell her off~~ have an arranged marriage by 10 where shed continue to be beaten for most of her life.

But they probably wouldnt kill a 3 year old.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago (2 children)

They’d beat her mercilessly and then sell her off have an arranged marriage by 10 where shed continue to be beaten for most of her life.

Developing Middle Eastern, Asian or African countries aren’t doing stuff like this in urban areas. The backwards religious attitudes are more prevalent in rural regions

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I agree with the mental hospital. They are not criminal, just criminally insane.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago

One does not exclude the other.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago

Should just drown the baby in the baptismal font, straight to heaven.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Shit like this makes me question my opposition to summary executions.

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