Via Berkeley Mews
Yeah, but sometimes that really is enough
this post was submitted on 30 May 2024
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Not enough for voters who are undecided about whether to vote or not.
Democrats win when turnout is high. It's not enough to be better than the opponent, to win they must beat apathy.
The two current candidates are so far apart the people who claim to be undecided are ignorant or stupid, willingly or otherwise. I'd understand riding the fence between Biden and Bernie, even if I've made my choice between them, but between Trump and Biden?
That's the kind of person who is undecided if they want to drive to work or walk down the middle of i-95
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What’s your position?
“Not a fascist dictator that openly wants to kill democracy.”
Honestly, no. In Turkey the opposition used that strategy since 2002 and lost every single vote, except the last local elections where they finally decided to do things a little differently (+ the financial crisis). If your only selling point is "not being the other guy" then your whole election campaign is basically an advertising for the other guy.
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The entire premise is BS because Biden has a list of accomplishments from infrastructure to debt forgiveness, progressive drug guidance, progress in gender/race equality, departments like the ftc and irs being competently run again with actual resources, to judge appointments. Hmm I wonder to who's benefit it is to ignore all that and label him "not Trump"?
He certainly did give a ton of handouts to corporations with nice sounding names, yeah.
And he offered the GOP every fascist policy they want on border with literally no strings attached. Twice. What a great totally-different-from-republicans guy.
Really knows how to reach across the aisle and be bi-partisan by...-checks notes-...giving the GOP everything they want with no conditions.
If less people like you voted for trump, he wouldn't have to negotiate with those assholes
I really despise that liars like this exist
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Biden bragged about cutting social security, has no desire to reform healthcare, and doesn't care about income inequality or labour rights. He looks at America's race-to-the-bottom economy and he's like "yeah. Everything is working just fine here"
Also, many of the things you listed here are basically just "not Trump/not Republicans" in their own way. You really think "appointed competent people to run government departments" is a positive and not just a non-negative point (as compared to what his opponents would do)?
Also, Biden is obviously fucking senile and I'm tired of people pretending he's not just because they're afraid it will give Trump power. It's totally fine to vote for Biden because he was the lesser evil, but let's not pretend he was ever a good option. When you ignore reality because it makes it harder to like your preferred candidate, you are doing the exact same thing the MAGA idiots do.
Before you accuse me of anything, you should know I'm Canadian and have absolutely no dog in this fight. This is my unbiased outsider perspective. I could give a shit who wins the next election in the US, but I'm tired of people lying to themselves about either of the candidates not being a steaming pile of shit.
Also, many of the things you listed here are basically just "not Trump/not Republicans" in their own way.
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substitutes everything the candidate runs on to "I'm not the other guy", because the other guy doesn't run on those things
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accuses candidate of running on "I'm not the other guy"
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I'm Canadian and have absolutely no dog in this fight.
Then kindly shut the fuck up. I'm an American, I've ACTUALLY had to live in this country with Trump and Biden as president, and it's no contest for me. I'd take Biden at his worst over Trump any day. That doesn't mean Biden is good, it means Trump is just that fucking bad.
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You're never going to get these people to acknowledge any of this stuff.
They'll still be defending whatever Biden 2.0 clone is in office a few cycles from now because "He only sent half the number of people to the gas chamber compared to [Identical GOP Incumbent]!"
That is the thing, the GOP isn't identical. It is pretty much worse every single time.
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cough supporting a genocide cough
Until then he was doing great yeah. Bit of a big one though.
And before you hit me with the usual I know Trump would be worse for Gaza but it doesn't change what Biden has done
1 he always supported it, so if you say "until" you just didn't care until it went hot, 2 I don't think it changes it that his opponent supports it harder, but it does speak to your options.
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Until then he was doing meh. After that he was also doing meh, because that has been the official policy of the US for at least the last 50 years.
So you have either "meh" or "let's do turbo genocide and have oil companies write environmental policy" (not even going into all the criminality). I find "meh" to be the clearly superior option, even if it doesn't align with my politics.
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Stop thinking that you vote "for" someone in a FPTP system. You don't. You vote against the guy you don't like.
It sucks, and I hate it, but don't delude yourself into thinking otherwise. We're playing a badly-designed game with a shitty controller and we're only allowed to press a button once a year at best.
Think Twitch Plays Pokemon, but with a lot more trolls and no moderation. There will be a constant stream of people voting to do something stupid and destructive, so you spend all of your time voting against them.
Oh, and their votes count for more, so they can win even if there's fewer of them. All we can ever hope to do is try to stop them and hope they don't fuck everything up and give themselves even more power before the next time we're allowed to pick a move.
Yay America. Greatest democracy in the world right there.
Both Democrats and Republicans have a vested interest in keeping the system as it is. They won't change it unless citizens make them change it.
Honestly I'm kind of losing hope that it's even possible at this point.
Positive change in the American system usually comes from the bottom up. If you're interested in fixing the system, the first step is to switch your local elections to Approval Voting, probably through a referendum. There's a whole bunch of reasons, and lots of second and third steps, but that's the first one.
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It is impossible. Most people don't see a problem with this. Especially the trolls who have more power than they should.
The only time things have even marginally changed in the US there's been violence. Civil rights, suffrage, the labor movement, ending slavery: All of them required thugs cracking skulls before they could happen.
So unless we have about 10% of the population willing to put themselves in harm's way we're stuck like this.
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"Well, that's not a very enticing platform! Who is your opponent?"
"Donald Trump."
"You have my vote."
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Pretty fucking relevant in this thread it seems.
You know the US does this too, right?
But unironically also vote for Biden. I wish there was more acknowledgement that there has to be some way to pressure a candidate to earn votes, being much less bad isn't going to get the 50k low info swing voters that decide the election
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"Everyone who disagrees with me is a secret agent"
No, not everyone that disagrees with me is a secret agent. A good chunk of them are. The rest are the idiots that believe and agree with them.
I'm still waiting for a good argument about how no voting or voting 3rd party gets better outcomes.
Maybe I'm the idiot for thinking there might be a good argument for it. Who knows?
The rest are the idiots that believe and agree with them.
Like any good conspiracy, it accounts for any possible contrary evidence one might encounter. If you find someone you disagree with irl, or someone online who doesn't seems like a secret agent, then it's simple - they're just people who have been manipulated by secret agents! The secret agents are still surrounding you and influencing every aspect of your life, regardless of silly things like "evidence" or "falsifiability." It's completely indistinguishable from a schizophrenic convinced they're surrounded by lizard people.
I’m still waiting for a good argument about how no voting or voting 3rd party gets better outcomes.
It's pretty simple. In a negotiation, having a credible threat of not cooperating gives you more bargaining power than if you show up like, "I will accept any deal you give me, I need this!" Voting is a negotiation. If politicians know that you'll vote for them no matter what you do, then they have no reason to listen to your concerns, whereas if you say, "I'll only vote for you if you do this, otherwise I'll vote third party" then they have an incentive to do the thing in order to earn your vote.
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I think it's interesting folks take this as talking about Biden.
Biden has a platform, Biden and the Democrats have accomplishments ... what does Trump and the last decade of Republican congressional dominance have?
"DEMOCRATS ARE DESTROYING THIS COUNTRY!!" "HEALTHCARE IS A MESS!! I'VE GOT A BRILLIANT PLAN I DIDN'T PASS OR EVEN PROPOSE IN CONGRESS LAST TIME. WE'RE GOING TO GET IT DONE THIS TIME. IT WILL BE SO MUCH BETTER THAN WHAT THE DEMOCRATS CAME UP WITH. NO I'M NOT SHARING IT NOW, YOU MUST BE SURPRISED." "I MADE MY RICH FRIENDS MONEY!!"
They have Project 2025 and it's horrifying.
When the opponent is Trump, isn’t that exactly the right thing to do?
FYI: Most of those braindead “am I not allowed to criticize Biden???” comments and posts on social media are a concerted effort by right-wingers from /pol and other such sewers, trying to get people to not vote against Trump. Don’t fall for it. These aren’t “lefties” or “tankies”. Just downvote, report, and ignore.
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I’m hearing this a lot lately too. Not from the Biden campaign, mind you. Just as a straw man in memes and comments in spaces like this.
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This year, that is exactly enough for me to vote for “not his opponent.”
In a system where all the non-winning votes are lost in a step and not counted at the end, like the USA form of weak democracy, this becomes a valid tactic.
It's not only the presidential vote that's like this, but ALL fucking votes. It's astonishing how weak the US system is.
And still some see the US constitution as this pinnacle of democracy when it's vastly outdated by now
Even the founding fathers anticipated a lot of reforms and for the whole thing to become obsolete quite soon but yet here we are with people worshipping them as this infallible being and weighting their words on a scale as if it's impossible for them to be wrong
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I mean... I usually agree with the sentiment the comic is trying to convey, but OTOH the "My Opponent" in this case is Trump.
So to be honest the #1 reason I'm voting Biden by far is that he's not Trump. But if you want another reason, how about that he finally stuck it to TurboTax and created a free federal tax filing system?
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if YOu'RE Not VOtInG FoR Not MY OppoNENt TheN YOu'rE VoTIng FOr oPPonENt!!!
Yeah, the "You're with us or you're with the terrorists" rhetoric has been pretty strong.
It seems both sides know that their brain-dead, geriatric candidates are pretty shit.
No matter how much you think both candidates are shit, you must be able to realize that one is far and beyond worse than the other.
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No you aren't. You're being told that this is all that's happening, but you aren't going to look for yourself.
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It would be nice to one time not having to vote for the lesser of two evils.
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Add a smarmy attitude and this is an exact representation of Pierre Polievre, opposition leader in Canada and likely to become the next PM
20+ years in politics (has never had another job outside of politics) and has only 1 bill under this name to show for (it was a bill to make voting harder)... and in over 2 years as opposition leader, he has yet to utter a single concrete idea other than "I'm not Trudeau"
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