this post was submitted on 15 Apr 2025
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Good good, let the hate flow through you. Purity is what matters, not affecting change. Go now, inquisitor.
You Lemmy progressives need to be honest with yourselves. If "not a fascist" wasn't enough to make you vote for Harris there isn't a candidate in the universe that would have passed your purity test. It's almost like you actually wanted Trump to win.
Oh I voted for Harris (and am also not the person you replied to) but "Compromise on all your ideals" describes the trajectory of the Kamala candidacy quite well. And that's best case. Worst case, as the atlantic suggested way back in 2020, she didn't share those ideals to begin with.
And that sprint to the right that she made didn't move the needle on R voters at all. She should have campaigned like she wanted Democrat votes, but she didn't. She talked a lot about her Glock and got cozy with the war criminals of the prior generation, didn't talk much about climate change, and even gave space on stage to Liz Cheney at the DNC instead of even giving a single minute to a pro-Palestine Democrat, to try getting some of the basket of deplorables to pick her. None of them did, and it didn't make Democrats very happy either.
Maybe if the Democratic candidate had acted like she wanted Democrat votes, this map would have looked different in the end.
💯
Keep going... What drives turnout? Citizen campaigning.
Maybe if leftists didn't spend the year leading up to the election protesting the better candidate we would have seen a better outcome.
So Kamala had no duty to motivate the people she wanted to vote for her? That seems a bit backwards from how I've always understood elections.
I agree that "Not Trump" actually should be enough in today's climate - but it wasn't in 2016, so why trot out that playbook again? Seems shortsighted and stupid, almost as if corporate donations and Republican voters seemed more imporantant to the DNC than Democrat voters, who were just expected to be "in the bag."
The proper assignment of blame is on Joe Biden for not getting out of the way to have a real primary.
People weren't given a choice for their candidate. Excitement drives Democratic turnout, and they've been tamping down expectations for decades now. There's nothing exciting about the campaign strategy of "we're not Donald Trump."
Blaming leftists for the failings of liberals is what keeps pushing the party establishment to the right.
I see the BlueMAGA crowd has moved from "you have to vote for Democrats" to "you can never criticize Democrats"
Moved? That's been the policy since 2016.
Ah, professional politician eh? That's some rarefied air there.
Lemmy Democrats did their strategy, lost, and blame leftists. Talk about being in denial.
That strategy won the majority of elections since the 90s.
Trump lost by more in 2020 and repeated his strategy just to win. Too bad he didn’t follow the leftist strategy of complaining and not trying to win.
He complained a lot. He complained after winning. The difference is, Trump campaigned to win right wing losers... The problem is... so did Kamala.
This constant blaming the left for Democrats' failure is the true psyop, and you seem to be foolish enough to play along...
He didnt just complain without trying to win. Like leftists are popular for doing.
Kamala campaigned to everyone. Trying to reach as many voters as possible because that is a prerequisite for winning elections and a reason leftists don’t win elections.
Russia needed Trump to win for their invasion. It is public knowledge that their strategy is to create infighting in the US so we are more divided and don’t get anything done. This is done by trying to push the right further right and the left further left.
We already know the GOP campaigns with the goal of preventing Dems from winning.
Kamala campaigned on making the wealthy pay their fair share so the billionaire class didn’t want her to win.
These are the obvious sources of “psyops” that are rampant on the internet right now.
This doesn’t even make sense.
if they want this title then maybe they shouldn't have been arming and defending the extermination campaign in Palestine
I’m convinced they are bad actors. With all the damage Trump is doing they still complain about the alternative like they are campaigning for the GOP.
All or nothing isn't as easy as you think for people. Lefties have a lot of destructive ideas that look superficially good, but cause mass division that doesnt need to be.
But every single mainstream Democrat is just as fascist outside of the US as the Republicans. They proved that when they didn't do anything about a genocide. They are also increasingly fascistic in the US as they demonstrated by being better at deportations than the Republicans. (Also, regularly breaking with Democrat voters to side with MAGA in Congress/Senate).
The Democrats are the same team as the Republicans, they just use different language.
Link because I don't think I can upload images on here: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FjBAU1OWAAAJB8W?format=jpg&name=medium
I bet you most leftists that use alternative media like lemmy DID vote for Harris. You're screaming at all the lemmings still over at Reddit...
I voted for Jill Stein, who's anti-genocide, among other things. The left needs to support more anti-genocide candidates.
The Democrats policy on Palestine seems pretty fascist to me.
Seriously lemmy can be wild in this regard. I got a death threat for implying democrats were better than Republicans.
I'm not in love with many of their policies, they don't go nearly far enough, but like damn they're obviously the better choice
You think Democrats didn't go far enough on exterminateing Palestinians?
The problem is that the democrats have been name calling for so long, that calling anyone fascist holds no weight. No one cares, they simply don't believe the democrats.
And so you need a bigger platform than "I'm not a republican".
If Kamala is mediocre what does that make Trump?
Secondly what is it about Trump that most strikes him as a conservative? What conservative values do you think he thinks about and values the most?
That Conservative value would be: an in party that the law protects, but does not bind.
Trump represents what Republicans want to vote for.
But this is about ideals and values of the left wing vs right.
What values and ideals does Trump have that appeals to them?
Lets see these "ideals" and "values" that Trump voters hold dear to their hearts:
So 3 out of 5 were about the economy 1 didn't like illegal immigration 1 didn't like war
So people voted largely for Trump because they felt the economy does better under him
And this looks to be backed up with this poll:
https://news.gallup.com/poll/651719/economy-important-issue-2024-presidential-vote.aspx
Is this a conservative value? a good economy? do leftists not value a good economy?
The term "the economy" here is too broad. Under Biden, by most statistical measures, the economy at a national level was doing pretty well with back to back 20%+ increases in the stock market in the last 2 years. But that wasn't what these voters were referring to. They were referring to their personal finances, their family's economy. Even the bits about not liking immigrants was their misdiagnosis that immigrants were negatively affecting their family economy. They think that immigrant being present meant that their family's economy was reduced. They think that any taxes levied on them unfairly reduce their family's economy. They were being squeezed from all directions, lower pay & job insecurity, sky high housing costs ("the rent is too damn high!"), out of control undischargable student loan burdens, bottomless health insurance and health care costs, spiraling home insurance costs from floods/wildfires/hurricanes, and finally the price of eggs.
These voters thought that this was a broken economy, but that is a misdiagnosis. This is an issue of income inequality. Too much of the wealth of the prosperous nation is confined to a tiny fraction at the top. And this mass of voters ended up voting to make this problem worse.
i agree with you but the guy i was arguing with claimed that kamala strayed too far from left wing values and thats why she didn’t win
my claim is something more fundamental, she didn’t assure voters that she would do better on the economy than trump
imo even if she did turn around and become the biggest pro Palestinian, transgender, anarchist, radical communist out there she still wouldn’t have won because the biggest issue to people was the local economy not gaza
she probably should have just offered everyone a tax cut
edit: and that trump has pretty much no values or ideals, just donald is #1 and he’s gonna fix everything and everyone else is wrong or stupid
I am not a fan of Bernie Sanders but I guarantee he would have won. The Democrats refused to give people the policies they wanted.
do you think aoc would have won as well?
Yes but like Bernie her goal is to not run so she can sheepdog leftists into the Democratic party. Not to run and win.
You are aware that Harris lost right?
Yes, it's possible to have 2 shit candidates you know :P
In Australia we are frequently voting for the 'least worst' candidate, we have mandatory voting so very few of us have this idea in our head that we need to run out and enthusiastically support a candidate, we just vote for the one who we think will do the least damage, in Australia Kamala would have won easily
Yes, and Kamala lost.
Australian doesn't have first past the post voting! What are you talking about!
I don't get it, how does this preclude having shit options to vote for?
Because the entire justification for "lesser evil" voting is that America has first past the post voting
I don't get it, can you explain it more? I'm not talking about the voting system, I'm talking about the culture:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesser_of_two_evils_principle#In_modern_elections
She can add it delivered Trump 2024 as well to that list
I feel like you may have missed the sarcasm in OP, unless I'm misunderstanding you.