this post was submitted on 13 Jan 2025
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[–] [email protected] 19 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (7 children)

That might have worked then. Not so sure nowadays. The work ethic was different back then.

Edit: I didn't realize the can of worms I opened up. Hopefully it stirs a little bit of constructive conversation. I realize I have an unpopular opinion here. That's ok. I wish all of you a prosperous and content life. I'm not here to stir up hate. I simply expressed my opinion. I've learned a little about how passionate some of you are about this topic. I never thought I would start such a hornet's nest.

[–] [email protected] 93 points 3 months ago (1 children)

People still create great shit when left to their own devices and properly cared for

Workers in the 90s are no different from any others

[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 months ago (4 children)

I was there in the 90s. Working full time. There was a noticeable difference in the work ethic from then to today.

[–] [email protected] 44 points 3 months ago

I wonder if any incentives have changed in 35 years...

Nope, it's Gen Y/Z who are the problem.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 3 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 14 points 3 months ago (10 children)

Ok. I'll bite. Even though I believe this conversation will go nowhere.

Differences I have seen in work ethic between the 90s and today:

  1. Constantly complaining about being broke but refusing to work any overtime.

  2. Refusing to do anything outside the scope of their job duties. Even if it's something small and won't take any extra time or energy off their current job duty.

  3. Demanding or taking long breaks causing others to pick up their slack. And then acting like the victim.

  4. Overly emotional about deadlines and jobs duties. Making decisions based on their feelings and not the job/project at hand.

  5. People then would usually figure out solutions to problems without any supervision. Ingenuity was rewarded and favored. Today, people seem to prefer to be micro-managed. This could also be a change in employer culture as well.

  6. Entitlement culture/attitude. More people today believe they are owed something without earning it. Hierarchical structures were more rigid, with clear distinctions between management and staff. Respect for authority was expected.

  7. Employees were more likely to stay with one company for years or even decades, building loyalty and expertise within their organization.

I guess I could go on. And not all of this is due to employees, rather, management issues that have gotten worse over time. But I still believe the root cause is a negative change in people's work ethic. This is obviously not all inclusive. These are just some examples of what I've noticed between now and then. I have been working full time since the 90s. Yes, it's anecdotal. But you asked me. This is my opinion. It's okay if people don't agree with me. But I would find it hard to believe most people would disagree with all or some of these points especially if they have been working as long as I have.

[–] [email protected] 43 points 3 months ago (13 children)

If people were payed more most of those problems would evaporate. There used to be a middle class in this country that made enough money to justify dealing with their boss's bullshit expectations. Now everyone is getting the bare minimum and management wonders why they're getting minimum effort. If you want people to have a better work ethic it has to be worth it for them. Dangle a fuckin carrot once in a while, you know?

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[–] [email protected] 36 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

I think you are mixing up cause and effect. Corporations stopped valuing their employees but expect the same kind of loyalty from when they used to actually pay enough. It's normal for employees to feel demotivated and give less energy to a job that doesn't respect them and is over eager to threaten and replace them.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 months ago (2 children)

I think I made that clear at the end of my above post

[–] [email protected] 27 points 3 months ago (3 children)

You got it backwards though. The root cause is not the change in work ethic. The change in work ethic is the symptom. People have to get nitpicky about breaks and such and show no loyalty entirely because companies stopped being loyal to their employees. This can be demarcated with the death of the pension.

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 3 months ago

And not all of this is due to employees, rather, management issues that have gotten worse over time. But I still believe the root cause is a negative change in people's work ethic.

Personally I'd say you made the exact opposite clear while throwing a lil blame at the management's way so it wouldn't sound as disconnected from reality. Beatings will continue until morale improves I guess.

[–] [email protected] 34 points 3 months ago (1 children)

If this is what you're seeing, the problem isn't the employees.

If you can say with a straight face that employees prefer to be micromanaged, that's the biggest, brightest, blinding red flag I can even imagine.

If you're seeing this, your company has a major issue.

[–] [email protected] 31 points 3 months ago

Entitlement culture/attitude. More people today believe they are owed something without earning it. Hierarchical structures were more rigid, with clear distinctions between management and staff. Respect for authority was expected.

This is the most middle-manager shit I've ever read. "Kids these days don't respect me!"

[–] [email protected] 26 points 3 months ago (19 children)

I didn't downvote you even though I disagree with you.

All of the examples you gave of differences have a distinct difference between working in the 90s and now. In the 90s we did all of the things you cite aren't happening today because it paid off with something better later. It could be a raise in pay, a promotion, or even just experience that could be leveraged at a future job earning more. It was also the time of the final Gen-X'ers entering the workforce, and there were far fewer of us than prior generations that age. This meant there was at least a form of scarcity of entry level workers so anyone that wanted a job could get one that would cover their basic bills. Employers would also train entry level people because there weren't other options for bodies to do the jobs. We put up with being treated like crap in the hierarchy because we saw that if we worked the hierarchy we would rise. We took risks professionally that would be innovative or creative that created a great product for our employer that would frequently work out. If the professional risk didn't pay off, we'd likely still be employed or at worst could get another job of near the same level without issue.

In short, we did all of those things in the 90s for the promise of a better tomorrow, and back then, there was one. Workers today know there isn't a better tomorrow, likely only a worse one. So why should they take the same risks we did professionally if they are not only far less likely to benefit, and are in a much more precarious position with far higher debts (student loans) and far few resources (lack of savings or real estate ownership)?

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 3 months ago

You could open up a new business cleaning boots.

I don’t even know where to begin.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 3 months ago

You sound like a bit of an exhausting cunt mate...

[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 months ago
  1. Salary Exempt, overtime doesn't bring in extra money.
  2. Job descriptions are vague. If you get this then you are asking the wrong person completely.
  3. You mean like lunch?
  4. So asking for clarification and telling them the deadline they pulled out of their ass is unrealistic.
  5. Just because ChatGpt says it can be done doesn't make it so.
  6. Agile, but who forced that on everyone?
  7. I guess killing pensions and having layoffs whenever the line didn't go up killed loyalty as it is a two way street.

Not accepting shit from bosses isn't bad work ethics. Corporations did it their fake personhood.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 months ago (3 children)

Its not my business but do you mind saying what industry you work or see this in?

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (3 children)

Sounds like a problem with your company culture. I don't think your description fits the industry as a whole.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 months ago (1 children)

It kinda just sounds like cool and interesting people don’t want to hang out with you. I wonder why.

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[–] [email protected] 42 points 3 months ago (1 children)

People have no work ethic these days, they won't even work for the exposure anymore.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

What are you talking about? They get plenty of exposure when they start up an OnlyFans on the side to make ends meet! /s

[–] [email protected] 30 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Small teams being allowed to do what they want can still give good results, but you aren't going to see that at major companies. I almost solely play indie games by micro or solo dev teams.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago

That's a great point. I do support indie games when I enjoy them. Not a fan of the micro transaction slop that huge publishers are pushing

[–] [email protected] 28 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Work ethic today is fine in places that aren't spreading their people as thin as possible. There's always going to be shitheads but for the most part when you see "poor work ethic" it's because everyone's burnt tf out and just doesn't care any more.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 3 months ago

There's some truth to this

[–] [email protected] 22 points 3 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 months ago

No this was a completely unironic old man "kids these days!" rant.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 months ago

You could also afford to work on failed projects because houses and healthcare costed two acorns and a peanut.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 3 months ago

You're just wrong. Devs today work far more than those devs did. Devs today work insane hours. It's nearly physically impossible to work more hours than devs do today.