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UK Climate Campaigners Get 'Utterly Disproportionate' Sentences (www.commondreams.org)

submitted 8 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 92 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (9 children)

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable“ - John F. Kennedy

I want a peaceful revolution more than anything, but it’s clear that it’s impossible. Join the IWW today.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago (1 children)

I don't know what the laws are like in the UK concerning firearm ownership, but I can't imagine they're on the side of arming the peasantry.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 months ago (6 children)

You can obtain guns, but there are limits and requirements to try to make sure they're being stored properly and only bought in reasonable numbers for legitimate purpose.

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[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago (1 children)

So you've tried basically nothing and are ready to reach for a gun?

[–] [email protected] 14 points 8 months ago

I’m doing a lot, I’m a trained union representative in the IWW and I’ve been active for a few years there. Lots of grass roots organising and direct action. But this isn’t about me, it’s about systemic issues and those in power aren’t going to be willing to give up that power without a fight. We have to be ready for that fight or we will lose and have to deal with the consequences. Do you think violence was justified against fascism in the 20th century? If so, why not in the 21st?

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[–] [email protected] 60 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

I've seen people caught in paedophile hunter sting operations get less prison time than Just Stop Oil did.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago

the people who give the sentences can only sympathize with one of these groups.

[–] [email protected] 41 points 8 months ago

"Just fight for the government you want" says the liberals ignoring that every time anyone even tries to think about changing things this happens.

Nothing can change while those ruling think keeping order and decorum is better than having to listen and change.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 8 months ago (1 children)

How to Blow Up a Pipeline

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Oh fun, cause a serious ecological disaster and give the ultra rich an excuse to take even more money from the government for repairs plus they get to ratchet up security using our money, probably let them silence meaningful arguments by labeling people terrorists too.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

How to Blow Up a Pipeline (film):

[...] to prevent local pollution by shutting off the pipeline flow [...]

[+] [email protected] 13 points 8 months ago (4 children)

[removed by mod]

[–] [email protected] 60 points 8 months ago (4 children)

A protest without making waves is just farting in the wind. Even if they do stand in the road, that's not deserving of multiple years in prison.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (4 children)

Okay, ignore the protest part for a moment and look at the crime...

A group conspire to intentionally disrupt a major highway, breaking multiple violations including endangerment of motorists, major disruption of public and emergency services, and recruitment of 45 others to aid the intent, causing~ $3M in damages. And, yes, people of the publiic obviously sustained injuries but there is fortunately no known causation of death. This for 4 days resulting in over 700,000 people impacted and an estimated loss of 50,000 hours to the public.

Now that could be for whatever reason. The Tories, MAGA supporters, West Ham losing, or YouTubers; doesn't matter. The law shows no bias or care and these actions, especially the conspiring and collusion, are certainly multi-year crimes.

[–] [email protected] 39 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Meanwhile, the cost of climate change and global warming far exceed every measure you've quoted, and yet nobody is being imprisoned for causing or accelerating them.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 months ago

If they are going to break the law anyway, go violate an oil executive as hard as that executive is violating the planet.

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[–] [email protected] 27 points 8 months ago

The law shows no bias or care

Completely false, the legal system is entirely biased towards the interests of the ruling classes and big business.

and these actions, especially the conspiring and collusion, are certainly multi-year crimes.

Yeah, nah.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 8 months ago

I look forward to those causing climate disruption facing a judge.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

Okay, ignore the protest part for a moment and look at the crime...

No. The "crime" is the means necessary to make the protest heard.

A group conspire to intentionally disrupt a major highway, breaking multiple violations including endangerment of motorists, major disruption of public and emergency services, and recruitment of 45 others to aid the intent, causing~ $3M in damages. And, yes, people of the publiic obviously sustained injuries but there is fortunately no known causation of death. This for 4 days resulting in over 700,000 people impacted and an estimated loss of 50,000 hours to the public

Which is less than nothing compared to the climate change and direct death caused by the fossil fuel industries out of pure greed every fucking day!

Get out of here with your Texas Sharpshooter fallacy bullshit!

Now that could be for whatever reason. The Tories, MAGA supporters, West Ham losing, or YouTubers; doesn't matter.

Of COURSE it matters! You can't just wave away their mission to basically save the world to make only the means matter!

By your metric, not only was Gandhi and Martin Luther King wrong, but so were fucking WWII resistance fighters!

Whether or not you're white, YOU'RE the moderate MLK is talking about here:

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

Which is less than nothing compared to the climate change and direct death caused by the fossil fuel industries out of pure greed every fucking day!

That's not the job of a court to handle in a specific case. We do not want a justice system that bends to leniency or malice based on opinions external to the case. Do you understand why society adheres to the concept, "justice is blind"?

Since you're dropping claims of fallacy out of context, I will help by putting it into context...

The court does not (and should not) care for what cause the sharpshooter in Texas murdered for, they are there to address the committing of murder and sentence justly so.

Unlike those principally involved in law, you have taken a side of personal opinion, making for a nightmare scenario of a judge. Though you obviously wouldn't last long in the judicial system applying personal bias based on what you think is right over the law.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

You're against democracy then? You're advertising anarchy.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 8 months ago (5 children)

Democracy isn’t god given, it’s a societal contract. We decided to give certain powers to certain institutions, and these institutions should serve our interests as citizens.

However what I see currently is that these institutions are working for the interests of the super rich. If you’re a nazi, you’ll get a „you you you“ for supporting an ideology that attempts to overthrow democracy. If you’re protesting against climate change or genocide, you’ll get beaten up by the police, and apparently sentenced to long jail terms to set an example.

It isn’t anarchy to try and force politicians to change. Protest is supposed to be disruptive as others already mentioned.

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[–] [email protected] 49 points 8 months ago

You cannot try and disrupt the country if it isn't doing what you want.

That's the only kind of protest that works ffs! Banning and criminalizing disruptive protests is a means of silencing dissent and always has been.

What you're getting in trouble for here is for the disruption, not the message's content.

That's what the liberals said to the original Italian antifascists too. And what "regular white people" in India and South Africa said to Gandhi. And what American liberals said to Martin Luther King.

You may think you're being magnanimous by supporting their right to silently protest in a corner where nobody notices them, but by advocating against effective means, you're squarely on the side of the politicians and corporations that they're protesting against and victimized you.

[–] [email protected] 41 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

This kind of disruption is exactly what climate change is doing - negativity affecting people just trying to go about their lives and make ends meet. Dumb decisions are being made which causes people with no choice in the matter to suffer.

The question is - why are you angry when poor people do it (on a limited scale, for a few hours) but not angry when rich & powerful people do it (to everyone, forever)?

That's the genius of this kind of protest.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Your take is however literally madness. It would be like you protesting on here that somone trying to get people medicine to survive if they raced across town disrupting traffic and you supported them being jailed.

I hope they can keep it up. The stupid attached to people not understating the impacts of climate change is appalling and will collapse civilisation. That's literally what XR, JSO etal want to try and do, prevent the collapse of civilisation and raise awareness of that so we do something. And people be like "my Uber Eats driver delivered me a cold buger, jail those protestors for life!!!?"

I get you're not brave enough to do this yourself but you'd think you'd at least support those who are!

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago (1 children)

This isn't anarchy mate. There are laws in a democracy too. You're making no sense.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Laws that the rich don't have to play by, only the common folk. So why keep playing?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 months ago (2 children)

If the rich are stupid enough to block highways they will get the same punishment.

What conspiracies are you talking about? Do you have any specific sources where certain people have higher privilages in the judiciary system of the UK? You cannot make strong claims like that without a source of a lawesuit.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 8 months ago (5 children)

I didn't mean direct examples of when the rich were blocking roads, I meant more like why can major corporations continually polite the environment either though dumping illegally or spills and never see jail time.

The rules aren't the same.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (3 children)

Good.

Edit:

On Thursday, Judge Christopher Hehir sentenced Hallam to five years in prison and Shaw, Lancaster, De Abreu, and Gethin to four each.

That's it?

Gonna switch my "Good" to "Well, I guess it's a start".

[–] [email protected] 48 points 8 months ago

Did an oil derrick write this?

[–] [email protected] 14 points 8 months ago (5 children)

Yeah, it's good rhet we stop people from trying to stop Humanities end. climate change will fuck you and your children for the next multi digit generations and frankly I wonder if there will be humans left when this is over, but sure... Lets celebrate jailing those that are trying to stop it.

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