this post was submitted on 12 May 2025
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[–] [email protected] 112 points 1 month ago (3 children)

I'd find it almost funny, how much capitalism as a system seems to favor those who are most capable and willing to detach morality from their actions for capital gain, if it weren't so sad.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 1 month ago (2 children)

There are good criticisms of other economic systems that have been tried, but capitalism really seems designed to transfer the most power and resources to the greediest and least ethical.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 month ago

No but you don’t understand.

Capitalism works because it pits everyone against each other and so even though every single person is greedy and unethical, they begrudgingly improve society overall because of reasons.

All we have to do is make sure we teach every child that all humans are fundamentally greedy and evil and the only ethical response is to out-greedy and out-evil them.

And then we’ll have a prosperous society!

  • Adam Smith basically
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[–] [email protected] 100 points 1 month ago (6 children)

We should end tipping culture. Wages should never be optional, and anyone working full time should be paid by their employer a living wage as described by FDR when the minimum wage was created.

Until we end tipping culture, tip your servers. You're not some edgy social justice warrior by quoting Mr. Pink and acting like keeping your two dollars is somehow helping. You're just an asshole.

[–] [email protected] 38 points 1 month ago (1 children)

The whole point of that scene was that even a room of psychotic killers was disgusted by the idea of not tipping.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 month ago (1 children)

It's amazing how many people saw it and said, "You know, the crazy-eyed murderer makes a good point."

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[–] [email protected] 35 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Until we end tipping culture, tip your servers.

If everyone continues to tip by default, then I believe this will delay or prevent an end to the culture. If servers don't have an issue with tipping (because everyone does so), then there is less reason to support change.

If one person doesn't tip:

You're just an asshole.

If a large majority doesn't tip:

Maybe there is a problem with tipping by default?

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 month ago (3 children)

That's not how anything works. If you want change, you need to vote for it. You're not going to change the entire economic structure of the whole restaurant industry by being a selfish asshole. You're just punishing the people who handle your food and making life harder for everyone.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Who do I vote for specifically to end tipping culture?

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I don't know where you live, but start local. And in the meantime, stop going to restaurants.

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 month ago (1 children)

If the large majority doesn't tip, wait staff will become homeless. That's the only "message" you're sending. Restaurant owners won't care in the slightest.

Don't patronize organizations that don't pay their employees. This is the message, you're claiming you want to send. You have to take money away from the people who set the policy, not the worker who has to live under the policy. Find restaurants that refuse tips and spend your money there. (Or just don't go out.)

Until we end tipping, tip your servers.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago (3 children)

...not the worker who has to live under the policy.

They don't have to work there.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 month ago (3 children)

They do, their alternatives are being homeless, or working at another company that's very likely managed the exact same way.

The lack of a social safety net or sufficient welfare, empowers exploitative labour conditions.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago

Are you advocating for no more servers? Or are you suggesting that only the desperate should do the job? Or is your point that someone who chooses to be victimized by society should simply accept their rung on the ladder?

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 month ago (18 children)

The single best thing people can do to end tipping culture is to just stop tipping.

Vote for social safety nets or make donations to care for those who will be harmed by this.

But right now it's people like you that are perpetuating tipping culture.

And yes, I am an asshole - but it's not solely because of my stance on tipping.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Well in Australia we don't have tipping.

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[–] [email protected] 44 points 1 month ago (7 children)
[–] FistingEnthusiast 50 points 1 month ago (1 children)

If you're somewhere like Australia or Japan, where it's not a normal part of the culture, then fine

If you're somewhere in the US where the laws around pay are shitty, and people rely on tips to survive, then you're a cunt for not tipping

I think tipping is shit, and that people should just be paid properly, but I'm not blind to the realities of life when I travel. So I do what is appropriate to be a decent person

[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Wouldn't that typically be called an enabler?

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago (1 children)

No, it would be called complying with the system that exists.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 month ago (5 children)
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[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 month ago (1 children)

That depends entirely upon the context. There are many situations where not tipping is rude. There are also situations where tipping is rude. "Rude" is a quality related to social expectations. You can be unintentionally rude due to ignorance of the norms, and that doesn't necessarily make you a bad person. But if you knowingly refuse to tip when tipping is expected for a provided service, then you're a shitbag.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 month ago (3 children)

then you’re a shitbag.

Not those refusing to pay them properly?

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (17 children)

If you knowingly buy chinese goods produced with slave labor you're a shitbag and they're a shitbag. There can be more than one shitbag in the chain.

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[–] [email protected] 36 points 1 month ago (1 children)

No your tips become profit for the greedy assholes who own the restaurant, you aren't compensating for non tippers, you are compensating for greedy cunts not paying people a living wage and the fact that most Americans can't understand this and are agreeing with the post calling people who don't tip as rude is why tipping is never gonna leave this fucked up country

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Not tipping is rude. You are not facilitating change by not tipping, because the burden of your choice is felt almost entirely by the worker you stiffed. The employer is not motivated to pay their employee more from reduced tips because they aren't really worse off for it. Sure, maybe their employee eventually quits if they aren't making enough, but tip industries typically have high turnover anyway, so the worker is already considered replaceable. The worker suffers from missing an expected part of their income, but they also lack the ability to make things better for themselves. So it's just piling onto their bad situation.

If you want to get rid of tip culture, stop patronizing places that rely on tips to give their employees a living wage. That's how capitalism works, businesses make changes in their power when something affects their bottom line. So you have to protest in a way that actually hurts the person with the power to change something, not someone caught in the crossfire. And of course, try to support reform that guarantees a living wage regardless of tips.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 month ago (1 children)

In Europe tipping is optional and the expectations are lower because the base wage is the full minimum, or higher.

In North America tipping has become a necessity because there is a lower minimum wage for waitstaff, which is a stupid arrangement that allows management/ownership to keep wages low and also now claim a portion of tips, for some reason.

Anyone who thinks that is a good system and that the problem is "cheapskates", not the deeply flawed system for paying waitstaff, is not thinking things through

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago (1 children)

It works both ways. If noone tips then noone will work at restaurants where their wage consists solely of tipping. That is also how capitalism works.

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 month ago (4 children)

I'm Canadian. Servers now make minimum wage. I have stopped tipping. It doesn't make any sense that a server who is making above minimum wage has to rely on customers paying a gratuity. Where were my tips when I was a lifeguard? Or a tour guide? I didn't get a bonus for doing a good job landscaping. I'm not angry at the servers. I'm upset at the ones who blame customers for the shady business that they help keep open.

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 month ago (2 children)

In the US, servers and restaurant staff tip like 100% of the time they go out because they know how important it is with our current pay laws, and they know that the waiter expecting that tip isn't the one making the laws or who deserves to be punished for them. So that tip is almost always going to someone else who also tips.

Btw, don't bother arguing with me that tipping is wrong so we shouldn't do it. I agree that it's wrong, but abstaining punishes the wrong people (servers, not owners or policymakers). So instead of writing a comment, write a letter to you local govt to eliminate sub-minimum wages for tipped workers, and keep tipping poor waiters and drivers til they change something.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago (2 children)

All the things I've read say that a majority of tipped workers (as well as the general population) prefer the current tips system. Maybe it's not true, but looking at the comments here it seems accurate.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Former tipped employee here. This is probably correct, but I don't care. The majority is often wrong. They can be educated. Change is scary, and the people who benefit from the status quo demonize changes that will give them less power.

I would probably have made less money if paid a salary, but it would be worth it to not have to balance priorities between getting a good tip and following restaurant policies.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (5 children)

I work at the most expensive restaurant in my town, FOH workers are paid $2.13 (regardless of tips) and servers have to tip out 30% to assistants and bar. If everybody stopped tipping one day then some of them will literally not even have the money to buy gas to go home.

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 month ago (1 children)

This comment section is all people missing the point.

The point of the post is that a particular job will generally stabilize at a particular pay. If it's a tipped position, then the employer will pay less, so that the overall income is roughly at that stable income for that position, including the overall average tip.

So people who tip less than the average are free riding off of the people who tip more than average, where that worker will make an average tip overall, which comes more from the generous tippers than the stingy tippers. Thus, it effectively transfers money from generous tippers to stingy tippers, on net, in the long run.

The merits of this system, whether servers deserve to be paid more, whether we should push for reforms so that this isn't the system, is besides the point. The post is making an observation of how things actually are, not advocating for how things should be.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 month ago (5 children)

No worker should depend on tips. Problem solved

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[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 month ago (1 children)

well yeah, that's why donations don't work either, somehow. consider:

if you're the person always donating to charity, and nobody else does, you're essentially providing the community service that should be provided by the community taxes. instead, you pay it all yourself. that's why taxes have to be enforced by the community: the first one to donate suffers a disadvantage, but if a general rule says everybody must pay taxes/donate at the same time, nobody loses.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 month ago (3 children)

Tipping is basically donating money to the waiting staff (in a broader sense, to the management of the restaurant).

I think there are more people in need of donations than the ones who move your food 10 steps.

I would 10000% pick my own food and cary it to the table, as I often do in many """lower class""" restaurants (diners?)

That, or add a flat service charge, add it to the check and pay fucking taxes (this is directed to the management).

I don't tip. But I don't live in the US.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

This is how a greedy person thinks. It's morbid, but fascinating.

I am not in a financial race against the people who do not tip. And if this guy thinks I am then he failed to factor in that people pleasers probably go a lot further socially in life and thus are likely to make more money. Maybe I tip not because I want to please, but because I have more expendable income than the average self-limiting greedy asshole.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I don't think the richest people are the ones who want to please people the most, I think the less they want to please people, the richer they get. Then they run society with their wealth and the people pleasers are at their mercy

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Lol... How is this a meme.

Anyway, just avoid joints that need tipping. Fuck the restaurant industry and their fucking owners. I am done with that shite

Tipping amount goes up and quality of food and service down

Then they act indignant when three dudes need the check separate 🤡

WTF am I tipoing for, asshole?

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago (15 children)

I want to share my perspective on this as someone who works for tips.

I don't like tips in theory, but I'd be below the poverty line without tips so I really appreciate them. I also enjoy that they act as a mechanism to adjust my wage to the work I'm actually doing; I produce much more value as an employee on a busy day than when it's dead, and without tips I'd make the same amount despite working much more.

I think realistically, unless we also massively adjust how the labour economy works, eliminating tipping would make profits higher for owners and make service industry workers poorer.

Like I'd gladly trade my tips for universal basic income, I would not trade my tips for poverty wages.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

The only way you can help increase the wages is to not tip, all it does is subsidize the owners

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